Week Thirteen

1:45 And welcome back to the Boundary Corner podcast along with my partners, Brian Siegler, Jonathan Talley and Shelton Moss. I am Curtis Wilson. We are a part of the College Heddle network. And this episode is brought to you by Doctor Jeremy Counts down at Counts Family Pharmacy, your friendly neighborhood pharmacy Three O 1 S Main St. Blacksburg, VA. Well look, everybody decided to show up this week. What y'all doing? Hey, full force, baby, full force. Like Voltron came together. Came together ready, ready, ready to go.

2:26 Fuck some shit up. Right, let's go. Let's go figure it out. We had a week off. Not we didn't have a week off, but the Hokies had a week off. Yeah, no, we definitely didn't have the week off and you know, and you got a promotion, right? I I did, I did. We're not. We're not going to go too in depth on that yet because it still hasn't been officially announced. On some channels but. Yeah, we're, we're we're excited though. It's it's, it's a, it's a good thing. It's a very good thing and I'm very excited about it. So we'll, we'll make that officially official next go round. But yeah, it's been a it's it's been a much needed buy, as Steven said there. I think, I think the team needed to buy. I think the fans needed to cool off a little bit because we were hot after that last one. And and it doesn't really get any any easier this week. So, you know, we we got a got a road trip down to Durham 7 and 3 Duke.

3:24 It's going to be, it's going to be a test. It is Wallace Wade Stadium Saturday night, 8 O clock, get everything ready. At least it's at night. Maybe I can enjoy a little bit of the day. Maybe not tonight, but at least a little bit part of the day. I can enjoy it. I hate three 30s. I'm going to tell you, for my health, a 330 game is the absolute worst. If I'm at the game, I love 3:30. If I'm watching it at home I hate 330. Crew at 3:30. So yeah, Shelton, you're awful quiet down there. How's everything going in the new apartment and the new in the new digs? It's been great, man. I'm here in the Berg, the the East Coast Berg, Williamsburg, VA.

4:04 So kind of getting settled in here to the new job, new place. So I like it a lot. Got some downtime. So I will be in attendance this weekend at Wallace Wade Stadium. I've never been to a game there. I've been to the campus once, but I've never been to a game there. So that'll be that'll be pretty exciting. I can't wait to go. BCP on site. Shelton, are you going to be in the booth? No, I'm just going as. I'm going as. A fan and as a fan this week going to sit in the fan or in the stadium, not up in the booth. That is awesome to hear. Well, as Brian said a few minutes ago, we did not have a game last week. Again, much of the detriment are good to your everybody's healthier. So there are no truths to tell, maybe some lies later on, but no truths to tell right now.

4:46 So what we're going to do is we're going to kick it right off. We have a good a, a, a podcast colleague of sorts you can say who's going to tell us a little bit about know the enemy with Duke and we've got pull them on here. We've got Ben Bird who is with Duke Bull city coordinators. Ben, how are you doing tonight, man? Ben, you're on mute. I got you here. Control. There we go. Sorry about that. I'm doing well. How are you guys doing? Doing great man, glad to glad for you to join us. And and as we were chatting offline here before we punched live, we found out that that Ben knows one of our good buddies, our our music man, Jason Long. So it's it's funny how small the world can get when you, you know, reach out and, you know, connect with different people in the sports world and all of a sudden, you know, somebody that was your neighbors with somebody you've known since middle school.

5:43 Yeah, that's right. Jason and Liz and my wife, we all knew each other, used to live next to each other, saw each other a couple weekends ago, had a good time. And so one of the good things about being in Roanoke is you get to know everybody. There you go. Jason advised me and Brian here in a text that it was a porch picking party where y'all called up a little music there. That's correct. We played some old time tunes. There were 123 and maybe five of us. Nice. Good. What do you play? I play guitar. I play rhythm guitar. OK, nice. Very nice. So Ben, obviously you know we were talking a little bit before you've been doing this about five years, give a little background about yourself and how because you're a one man operation, right?

6:29 Yes, so the website's Bull City coordinators and you can find me on most social media accounts at Duke FB coverage. I started doing this in 2019 when the Cutcliffe era started going off the rails after the jump pass against North Carolina. Over time, it evolved into a podcast because I got tired of writing angry, frustrated complaints on the Internet. I just didn't think that was really productive. So I tried to be a little bit more positive, a little more upbeat, and that resulted in podcasting where I was interviewing former players.

7:20 After that, I got to a point where I started interviewing last season, more journalists and having other bloggers and podcasters who cover team come on, which led into being on the part of the College Huddle network, which you guys are as well. So that's kind of what it's evolved into, altering the format again, because of the unplanned evolutions of things. My podcast has a spin off called the Classical Antiquity Side Quest in which I interviewed professors various periods of time throughout ancient ancient Rome and Greece in the accounts for those on social media.

8:06 I deleted the Twitter account for it because it was just getting spammed by bots. It's really annoying. But on blue sky it's antiquity pod and I've gotten a lot of traction over there. So if you want to find me, go check out antiquity pod on blue sky. And the the blue sky classics thing is real. It's big and there's almost, I'm not getting barraged by pornography bots like I was on Twitter. It's it's worked out pretty well. So you can you can subscribe, like and subscribe at our YouTube channel to both podcasts. Nice, nice. So you got a, you got a couple history majors on here as well. So that definitely, you know, you got some interest piqued with that.

8:52 So always fun to like kind of mix a little bit of everything in in in your social media persona there and kind of bring in all your all your passions into one place. So I can appreciate that. So so we got a game this weekend and you know, we got with you were like, Hey, you want to come on, talk a little bit about what your team does well, you know, some areas that they can improve and kind of help us preview what to expect this Saturday. So we'll, we'll kick it off with defense first. You know, you got defensive coordinator Jonathan Parker, you got Manny Diaz's obviously got his, his fingerprints, his DNA all over that defense.

9:32 Tell us a little bit about what the defense is about from a scheme perspective and you know, kind of what some of the strengths and weaknesses are of that scheme. Well, as far as the scheme, what Jonathan Patchy does and Manny Diaz do is they get after the ball aggressively. They bring pressure at the right time. They kind of confuse their blitzes and their coverages. But I think primarily what you see is a lot of the plays that they have had a lot of success on or more coaching, small techniques like punching the ball out, generating turnovers, things like that. Tackling is really good. You see in a lot of four, two base defenses, the secondary has been a lot. I thought they were going to be OK, but it's been a lot better than I've I've expected, primarily because Terry Moore, who's a converted running back at safety, just has been in the right spot a lot.

10:28 And I know they say you can coach that, but really you can't because the ball's got to happen to go there too and then deflect the right way and land in his hands. It's just been for the Blue Devil fans out there and the guys who might remember Devon Edwards 2013 season where he was always in the right place at the right time. That didn't get repeated. He still had great plays, but it wasn't like that again. OK, Chandler Rivers has been a big help. So is Kendi Charles, the linebackers, Nicholas Bergeron, Howard Freeman, all those guys have been playing great. But this is a defense that just brings pressure, is aggressive on every down and likes to get after either the quarterback or the running back behind the line of scrimmage. I think we're leading the nation in tackles for loss. We're right up at the top.

11:20 Against NC State, the 1st 2 plays of scrimmage for the Wolfpack were tackles for loss, one of which was the safety. I mean, this unit's going to get after you. And I like a lot of teams. You have a running quarterback, it's going to cause problems. But overall, Dukes and Ben don't break defense and we'll make plays. All right, let's, let's talk about that pressure because when I started looking at it and the games I watched, plus just looking at the stats and data, Wesley Wilshams jumped out. You know, he had a great game against MC State coming off the edge. They're creating pressure sacks. You're also right. Duke is stirred in the nation and tackled for loss. When you watch him, what do you feel his best pass rush move is? Yeah, it's hard to say because I mean, I I don't, I don't pay to subscribe to watch and break the videos down and really slow it down.

12:10 But what those guys do generally is they're just fast. They're in great shape. And I think it's primarily through coach feely the what most places call strength and conditioning. I think Duke calls it athletic performance. I don't know, whatever you want to call. I mean, who cares? I mean. Yeah. I I mean, I don't want to upset the Duke football account that's following me on my blue sky account now, but who gives a shit what terminology we use for it, OK? I mean, really. So that is what it is, right? Right. They're just really fast and really strong. And one of the things they talk about in the fourth quarter is dragging teams into the sewer, which is not a reference to It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia and Charlie and those guys going down on the sewer, OK?

12:54 It's a reference to we are going to bring you down here. We're going to get dirty, we're going to get physical, we're going to beat you, OK? And So what you have to look out for is a lot of Duke teams historically as the season went on and late in games would tire out, OK? They would tire out because they were exhausted, because they didn't have a lot of depth, the strength and conditioning wasn't as good, and they wouldn't be able to compete through all four quarters, much less all four parts of the season, Right? But that's not the case now. I mean, I was talking to Steve Weissman at the News and Observer on our podcast recently. This team's got like 7 guys who can play on the line. And that's unheard of for a Duke team. I mean, they rotate guys in and out, give them chances to play. So I'm way off of your question, but I think what Williams is really good at in the rest of the line is that just being physically strong and fast and not tiring out and getting worn out.

14:01 Good stuff. So you got Williams out there. Who else should we kind of look out for on that defensive line for Duke? One guy who's come along real well as the season has gone on is is Candy Charles. Not that he started slow or anything, but you could tell he was making his presence felt there it early. It may not have been shown up in the stat line, but the last several games the guy's just been doing really well. He is a guy that you have got to control right there in the middle. He was a transfer coming in from Liberty and he has really, really played well. I mean, he he would be a guy that you've got to find a way to slow down and double or something to keep him from getting at getting at the at, at the quarterback or getting into where the running backs going to be getting the hand off on, on any RPO you're trying to run. Nice.

14:58 We'll pivot on the linebackers here. Oh, go ahead, Curtis. What you. Got Oh, no, no, I was going to actually last about the linebackers, too. Go ahead, Brian. Yeah, I was going to say. So you kind of talked about, you know, transfers there and yeah, I want to talk to you a little bit about that because it looks like, you know, Duke, at least over the last several years, you know, going back to Elko and now. So with Manny Diaz really hitting the transfer portal pretty heavy to to feel the the the depth pieces kind of those first and 2nd lines on the on the roster there. And you got a couple more at the linebacker position there with with what Howard and and Nicholas, correct. So, you know, looking at those guys and just thinking about how Duke has has done has been pretty successful in the last few years with kind of backfilling these positions through the portal.

15:47 And then you, you know, compare that to to what's happened elsewhere. A lot of success considering the number of replacements there. But you know, these these linebackers, along with Bergeron and Freeman, from a statistical standpoint, they're all kind of, you know, jumbled in together. They're a little bit kind of who's the the biggest key to a successful game from the linebacker position. Well, I think you got to be looking at a guy like Ozzie Nicholas. He has played really well. He came in from Princeton. He's really smart. He can knock the ball loose. He can make some plays. He's been hurt a couple of times this year. Nick Morris, I can't remember the last time he played and there was some concern about not having him available, but the other guys have stepped in and played very, very well.

16:32 And Freeman, not that Freeman has played poorly or anything, but it was to some extent A1 1 1/2 man show last year with him and everybody was kind of looking at Freeman as he was going to be the guy to do everything. And I'm not knocking him, but the other folks have really done a lot more as far as noticeable impact plays. But Freeman's a guy that can go in and get you 10 tackles easy a game. I think it's just part of the system that that's designed and nobody's upset about it. But you know, those guys can play really, really well. Bergeron too. But but Nicholas is a guy that you've got to watch out for if you're Virginia Tech.

17:13 All right. Note taking. That'd be Ozzie Nicholas. So you gave us a lot of good points about the defense there. You took my question away on Moore and Rivers because obviously those two guys popped out and you telling me I'm worried about Terry Moore because of the way you talked about how he gets in there and the way when I think of that and I know Terry's a safety, like that's the guy coming up in the line doing that, knocking it loose. And you know, he's already I believe I'm not mistaken. He's already got a couple forced fumbles this year along with picks. So you you answered my question for me in your monologue there at the beginning, Ben. So let's kick off. Obviously we know y'all got a really good defense because that's Manny's 48. I want to go to the offensive side of the ball, offensive coordinator Jonathan Brewer scheme, What does he do? What do you like?

18:04 What do you dislike when you look at this offense? The one thing before we get to that, I do want to say watch out for Chandler Rivers in the secondary. He he will do something in this game on Saturday, at least one play. If you throw to him, he will find a way to make you pay for it. But to turn to the offense, Brewer runs a system that's very similar to what is run at SMU with one critical exception, which is Malik Murphy does not run the ball. He does not run much, just it's not who he is. So he did get a rushing touchdown. It was ugly, but it was still a rushing, rushing touchdown against NC State. He's run a little bit more as the season has gone on. Earlier this season, there was a lot of get the ball out and get it out fast.

18:56 But there have been injuries at the tight end position which have slowed things down as far as how quickly the offense would like to go because some of those routes over the middle are not there. I'm not trying to critique a third string guy, but he's third string for a reason and you can't expect him to be as developed and talented as well. Talent's not the right word, but you can't expect him to put on the show that Nikki Dalmolin was capable of putting on. I think Dalmolin was a fifth year returning senior before unfortunately, his college career came to an end with a with a bad injury, so that slowed things down some.

19:39 They do like to throw to the tight end. Jake Taylor's getting more comfortable, so we'll see. He's he's, he's gotten a lot better. He didn't play much last year and honestly, he wasn't slotted to play a whole lot this year. So how fast you can bring them along. You know, next year he could take that big leap. He's just got a lot he's got to learn. It's a new system, new coaching staff. It's a lot for the guy. But the rest of the offense, you've got really good receivers at with Eli Penkel with. Obviously Jordan Moore who made a great catch against Miami, that one handed grab and then the catch against NC State for the touchdown.

20:24 Those guys are really, really good. And then to keep with an inside Duke football online joke, don't sell your Samir Hagen stock. It's rising, OK? He's really fast. He can get on some underneath routes, he can burn you, and he can be right where he needs to be. I don't want to say the ball's been spread around a whole, whole lot this year because Jordan Moore's been had been on a pitch count for a long time, which impacted the rest of the offense and what could happen. But as long as he's healthy, I expect the ball to be thrown around a lot because the offense is going to gravitate or the defense, excuse me, is going to gravitate towards Jordan Moore, which is going to open up Eli Pankel, which is going to open up Samir Hagens and some of the other guys to perhaps get some touches. And then it's going to come down to the running game and how successful that can be, which is a little bit of a longer discussion.

21:23 All right. You, you, you highlight Jordan Moore there. What is he? What is his best attribute? What is he? Look at him. What? What, What's the thing he's going to do that's going to hurt you the most? Well, with Jordan Moore, it's his, you know, one of the things that I like about what Brewer is doing, because I didn't really fully answer that question and I apologize. I think Brewer's doing a really good job and how you utilize Jordan Moore is a good example of that. Even with the injuries this team has had to navigate, what Jordan Moore can do is get down the field. He can get open and he can go up and get the ball. If it's thrown high, he's hard to defend. He is a converted quarterback.

22:08 Years ago in a spring game under Cutcliffe, I saw him with the offense and I said this guy's going to be special. He's got it. There's just something about it. I didn't think he was going to be this good, mind you, but I thought he was going to be a good player to Duke, and he turned out to be. He's hard to defend. He can go up and get the ball. And that's what Brewer likes to do. And you know, there's been some complaints about Brewer this year, but I think when Jordan Moore is healthy, this offense looks a lot better. And you can see what Brewer wants to do with the ball, which is spread it over the field, take shots down the field to open up the run game and really let the quarterback air it out at times. So if you see man coverage, if you see single man coverage, watch that ball go deep.

22:50 Kelly, go ahead, man. You're, you're freezing. Is you're about to ask your question? Oh yeah, you know how it is. Internet crazy now here, but I was just going to ask about the offensive line. When you talk about the running game, you know, Murphy's had a pretty good year. Offensive coordinator has really utilized, you know, you guys as talents that you have there. So how does your offensive line kind of work? And who's the key to the offensive line? Yeah, that is a really good question. I don't know how best to answer that. The the offensive line has been a little bit of a work in progress because there were a lot of new guys coming in.

23:31 But there's been guys like Pickett on the line who've been, who've been very good, who've been playing very well. Bruno Fina's been there as well. And there's a good number of other guys. And actually what we saw against NC State was the line went to, they had six guys on the line to help with pass blocking and some of the down the field routes and it it worked. I don't know how much we're going to see that again. I think that was more of a calculated choice just to throw the ball against State, but we'll see. The offensive line, I don't want to say has done poorly, but what we saw for a good part of the season was this focus on shutting the run game down and making Murphy beat you at the pass.

24:16 So * Thomas has done well at times. Peyton Jones, who I think is going to play at times. Jacques Moore may actually play this game. It's unclear. He's going to red shirt, but he's got one more game of eligibility. So it'll either be this game or Wake. If he plays. It could just be fluff from the coaching staff, who knows, But I think for the offensive line to do well, it's going to depend to some extent on what Virginia Tech decides to do. If Virginia Tech says we're just going to load up the box, put eight guys in the box, OK, and we're going to bring our safeties down, you know, it's going to be hard to run against that.

24:59 I don't care how good of a line you are. But if if the safeties drop back like Carolina, like in the Carolina game where that there were two high safeties * Thomas and Peyton Jones, who should be back from his injury that he suffered against State. Excuse me, I expect, you know, I expect some success there running the ball, especially if if Murphy keeps it on one or two RP OS. If he keeps it and then the hokey defense has to be honest, that's going to really help the offensive line. If he decides he doesn't want to run, then they just key in on the running back. You know, we'll see.

25:41 So I think how well the offensive line is going to do is going to be more a focus of what the Hokies defensive strategy is going to be. If the Hokies say we're going to make you throw to beat us, the offensive line will pass block. They're very good at that, that unit's good at that. But how much they're going to be able to run out of that if you've got 7 or 8 guys in the box all night, I don't know. Sheldon, you had some you wanted to add, right? Yeah. So you know, typically when we're playing a team like to look at kind of the the stats, advanced stats and kind of see what they do well, what they don't do so well. So looking at Duke, the one thing that stands out to me on offense, 3rd and 4th down conversion rate put together, they rank 132nd, just 29% on those late downs. Now, as we know, a lot of it has to do with the the, the distance that you're facing on 3rd downs.

26:31 You know, if you're in 3rd lung, obviously much less likely you convert the down from your perspective. I know the online struggle a little bit. Running game hasn't been super efficient. What do you think has been the big bugaboo on 3rd downs and why? Duke has just been so incredibly inefficient there. I think a lot of it probably early in the season has been struggling to get the field position that you'd like. There was a lot of incomplete run for two yards and then you're in 3rd and eight. A run for three yards, you're in 3rd and seven. That's had a lot to do with it. I also think, again, Murphy is still pretty darn young and he he's developing.

27:14 He's developing and growing as a quarterback and he's looking more comfortable with each game. So I think that's had a lot to do with it. I don't think historically Duke has been particularly good on those yards for a while. I I'd have to go back and look because I'd I try not to get too crazy into those kind of statistics, but I think that that has a lot to do with it. I'm looking at the box score from last game. I'm trying to pull it up here, but this might be accurate. Duke was zero of nine on 3rd down. That's hard to believe, but wow, no, it's not. I think it's probably more a game of of an issue of field position more than anything else. And as far as where they are on those down in distances they can when they want to.

28:08 Well, I could go on a long tangent about not putting quarterbacks under center. I'm not going to do that, I won't, but I do think some of that plays into it. Although they did put Murphy under center a couple of times. That could change a little bit this week though on some of those third down plays because last game Grayson Loftus came in for a play and a play or two and ran the ball. It would not surprise me if we see a small Loftus or Bealing package for backups. Loftus is going to red shirt this year. He can play these next two games and he can come in and be like a Thomas Sirk or Brandon Connect type. And if that happens then you're looking at a very different dynamic.

28:58 Loftus is a little bit of a gunslinger too. He can throw better than Sirk or Connect good I think, but he can run real well too. Let me ask this, Ben, and does it give you pause for concern that the only game this year that Duke played against the top five pass rush was against Carolina, A top 25 pass rush was Carolina allowed five sacks in that game. When you start hearing APR, you start hearing the names of Virginia Tech, currently 10th. How much does that give you concern? Because I look at Duke's numbers, it's like, wow, that's a great pass rush. And I looked at the Carolina game and it's like, that's the best pass rush they've seen.

29:42 Malik Murphy was on his back a lot during that game. I have a hard time believing North Carolina's pass rush was that good. Is that accurate? I'm not doubting you, but I just. North Carolina ranks, I'll get it for you right here in team sacks they are. I got to get it back to it because it was on another screen. Of course they are the 5th rated pass rush or team sacks in the country. Text 10th. On on the Carolina one, I think, I think we got to get a recount on that. Jump pull the data for me man.

30:23 No, no, no. I'm not questioning it, I'm not questioning it. I just that just kind of speaks to. It doesn't feel like it. I I I agree with you from that respect. Coordinator there it was at Georgia Tech. We call him a can of tuna online Jeff. Collins, Oh, Jeff Collins. It seems like yeah, the can of Tunas team should be doing a little bit better with that soft schedule that they've had all season. You know, the thing that worries me about playing Virginia Tech is Virginia Tech always has a lot of talent. They always have tall guys in the secondary. I think though, Murphy, what we were at that game, the offense struggled early but picked it up late and he's a different quarterback I think now than he was at the beginning of the season. I'm not too worried about the Carolina game as a reference point for it, but I am worried about anytime you play Virginia Tech, there's always a good deal of talent there that you have to be worried about, right?

31:29 That's what that's what worries me about it more than anything else. It's just the talent level that Virginia Tech will always have or should always have. You know what it's it's always fun to have someone on that can shit on Carolina with you. So thank you. I'm just going to. I'm going to say it, You know, look, this was a year you people are talking about. Oh, Carolina's turned a corner. They're back. If they don't win 8 games, there's no excuse for it. They haven't played. I mean, if they had Georgia Tech schedule right now, they would not have won it. They would not have won a game. We know this. Come on, let's be real. Yeah, when when our friend from Georgia Tech from rec talk was on here, he, he he got the whole Jeff Collins thing rolling. So it's, it's it's been a fun year to kind of shit on the UNC defense despite them apparently being a, a fairly good team when it comes to team sacks, though, apparently most of those came against UVA and I guess Duke at this point, if we're if we're looking at the the the accumulated sacks, though. But you talked a lot about Malik Murphy and, and kind of what he does with his legs, or in this case doesn't do with his legs. I mean, he looks like he's he's a pretty good athlete when he does decide to run, but it just doesn't look like it's it's motivated part of his game.

32:48 So talk about that a little bit. I wouldn't quite put it that way. When he runs, it's not pretty. I'd say a little bit of wiggle. I'm not necessarily saying he looks like he's going to go out there and and you know, put a track meter or anything. I. Appreciate that you're trying to put a positive spin on it, but but it does not look, you know, you remember when Charlie Batch couldn't. Slide. OK. All right. That's fair. It's like that, except Charlie Batch had a more natural run in motion to him so. Yeah, it'll hit you in the giddy up. Well, I don't want to quite say it's like Luigi and Mario 2 with the weird jump legs, but it never looks good when Murphy is running. So.

33:37 But that's not what he's there. That's not what he's there for. OK, that's not what he's there for. But what what he can do. He can throw the ball deep. He can put touch on it. You know, he can He can move the ball all over the field. He can hit short routes, He can hit wrong long routes. He's very good at throwing, at throwing the football. And if he sees single man coverage, he's going to give his receivers a shot. So he's a guy you got to worry about and he has run some. And I think that that is something that if he does just a couple of times a game, the defense is going to have to keep honest. But you know, he's been a it's, it took him a little bit to get his sea legs under him.

34:22 And I think he's got them under him now these last several games. So I think we're all excited about it. And if you look at how he played, the Florida State game was more by design. He didn't do a lot. But SMU, Miami and NC State, he's had three really good games. I know with Miami, he had the picks. I think one or two of those might have been bounces, deflections off hands of receivers. That happens sometimes. So he's looked a lot better of of light. Yeah, and he, you know, looking at him throw the ball, I mean, he's got a cannon of a right arm. So the the ball definitely gets out there and he can make all those throws. So if he, if he can give us, you know, any, any sort of trouble with the with the decoy, with his legs there, I think that that could be interesting and open some things up for you guys, both in the running game and the passing game.

35:17 And then as, as we kind of wrap it up here and you kind of look to Saturday night, what's your one big key like as you're sitting here, it's probably going to be 11/11/15. And the big key one way or the other is. Not to simplify it, but turnovers and field position, I think the team that can control the turnovers, again, this is ground breaking stuff. No one will tell you this, right? This is football's a lot simpler than we like it to be. But I think the team that controls the turnover battle and the particularly the field position, the field position can come in a number of different ways. It can be done by pushing the Hokies back by tackles for loss or it can be done by the kicking game. So those are the two things I'll be watching come Saturday primarily.

36:17 I mean, if if Duke's in that backfield causing havoc, I think it's going to be a good good evening. It's going to be a good night for the Blue Devils. Not not so much of a good night for my buddy Chris, who's coming down to the game with me, but we'll see. He's a he's a Hokie. Hey, you're, you're in Hokie country there in Roanoke. So it's probably probably a bunch of your buddies wear the maroon and orange on a regular basis. Good number of them. We're here, man. Well, listen, I mean you, you tell the truth about that man. Because you know Duke, you guys, your turnover margin is top five in the country. Your turnover gained is top five in the country. So you know, I, I, I don't think you're lying about that whatsoever. But Ben, man, it's been a pleasure talking with you tonight.

37:03 Real quick, give you one more time. Tell everybody where they can find you, social media, websites, all that good stuff. All right, before I do that, I just want to say one thing about comparative schedules for North Carolina and and Georgia Tech. Go back to my point for this fraud Tar Heel team. They played Minnesota, Minnesota whoopty frickin do OK Charlotte, North Carolina Central. I'm not going to knock those guys. I love them. James Madison in a program transitional year, OK. In a basketball game. Oh, exactly. And some Carolina fan before the Duke game tried to talk smack to us about it. I said we're going for 71, shut your mouth. And then the only the only games that they have had to play that are tough this year, OK, that you look at the schedule are Duke, Pitt, Georgia Tech. OK, now, Georgia Tech had to go to your house, right, To play Virginia Tech?

38:01 Yeah. Who? Who does North Carolina get instead? Virginia, The Cavaliers, not a real football team. Come on, let's. Get things we can. Agree wearing pants. Things we can agree on. All right, I mean for real, just compare those schedule. This was all the ACC helping Mac Brown out, Brown out. Pathetic. Just disgusting. Anyway, all right, so where can you find us? You, you or find me? You can find me at bullcitycoordinators.com. Check out the YouTube channel which I think is at Duke FB coverage. Most all the socials are there. You can get both the podcasts, the Bull City Coordinators Duke Football coverage podcast, and the Classical Antiquity side quest which covers topics from ancient Greece and Rome. Do about one episode a month.

38:46 I've got 2 I need to edit and a couple more I need to record. That'll get me into next year and on the socials for that one. Primarily just blue Sky at Antiquity pod. For the three of you who are decentralized weirdos who hate over over control of technology, I'd have Mastodon accounts. I don't really do a whole lot with it, but at Duke FB coverage on Mastodon and at Antiquity Pod on Mastodon as well. And the Instagram account for Duke football coverage just has both. I don't, I don't have two Instagram accounts. So that if you just just check out pretty much any social that Duke FB coverage or at antiquity pod, it's a great, a great merging of football and the classics. So you can hopefully find something that you enjoy. I got interested in ancient Rome later in life. So it's just kind of something I've picked up in my 30s. Nice.

39:48 It's always good to have a little bit of a passion project, especially when you pick up a little bit later in life. Especially when you deal with the typical misery of Duke football over the years. Ben, we again appreciate you having on. Thank you for making us laugh. Thank you for making us say fuck you VA, fuck Carolina, because we appreciate that. And maybe the next time when we roll through Roanoke, we'll hit up Jason, We'll hit up you and go to what is it, the food truck? Mama Jeans is Mama Jeans the food truck. Oh man, that's right. Yeah, yeah, that's right. Yeah, I, I that stumbled them on Facebook one day and their food looks amazing. So I'm going to find that truck next time I go to Roanoke. There you go.

40:32 Well, that'd be good. I'd love to catch up with you guys and Shelton. You said you were coming to the game. That's correct. I'll. I'll be there. Let me check real quick, see where I'm sitting. I think I'll be in. Yeah, I'll be in Section 30 near the top. 30, OK, yeah. So if you want to swing by, I'll say hello will do all right. Awesome, Ben. Well, appreciate the time and you have a good evening. All right, you guys too. Thanks for having me. On appreciate it, Ben. Yes, Sir. All right, Ben, thank you. All righty guy there was Ben bird with bold city coordinators, so go check him out again. Small world.

41:18 It's really hilarious. You start talking to somebody and they know somebody even own literally your whole life. We know we probably could point deaths. It is. That's why Jason's going to take us there next time. We're down and rolling up, but but to be for real now, like that's that's the funnest part about doing this. We always run into people that somehow know somebody we know in some way, shape or form. And that's why I love doing it. Ben was great. A lot of good info there. So as we normally do after we get to know the enemy and Ben did a great job talking about a lot of key players. So maybe little wrinkles we might see from Duke. We've got to talk about the Hokies keys on Saturday night down in Durham and Shelton.

42:02 I'm going to start with you first. What do you have? What is the key to this game at A5 and five Hokies attempt to get bowl eligible in the Bowl City. I mean, well, the biggest key, I guess is motivation because you know, you're playing, you're a 500 football team playing for bowl eligibility. If you lose this one, you never know what can happen next week in CVA. So, you know, just come be, show up motivated, you know, show up like, you know, you you want to play and and this is what you know, you're getting paid to do because, you know, these guys are getting paid now. And as far as the game itself, I mean, I don't know, I think I don't think tech will have trouble stopping the run because I don't think Duke's been very good at all running the football. So I'd say just, you know, if they could stop fast, I think that make Duke pretty one-dimensional offensively. It's going to be a low scoring game. So just, you know, don't get beat with a deep ball. That should should be a pretty good strategy. All right, Tally.

42:56 What about you, man? Man, I don't just see it. Just. Kind of the piggyback on what Sheldon said, You got to coach and play for your job. You're getting paid. As far as coaches, definitely getting paid. But you know, players NIL, you're getting paid as well. So when I say coach and play for your job, coaches, somebody got to go. Somebody got to follow on the knife. If you like being here, fucking do something right and hope it ain't you because somebody got to go. At the end of the year, players, I'm players are playing four position, you know what I'm saying? Because coaches if they're coaching for the job and you're not getting the job done, they're looking to put somebody else in that spot to go well, we could have been better if we would have had a better blank, you know, whatever the case might be, or if this person wouldn't have got hurt and we had somebody to back him up, we could have done this.

43:49 So players, if we get an opportunity to play when people's hurt, you got to play, you know, or if you're playing for, if you're playing for film, to go somewhere else. Like you got to have that. You got to get in here and you got to act like it means something and you got to play for your job. Yeah. All right, Brian. Tally makes a great point there is that you know regardless of what next season holds, whether you're here, they are anywhere else, You, you, you. These still matter because your tape matters. What you do from a coaching perspective matters. Everything is still, I think, big from that perspective.

44:30 So don't lose sight of the fact that just because you're only playing for a bowl at this point that you don't have anything to play for from a big picture standpoint. But the thing I will talk about it and actually Robbie put it in here, but I had already had it on my notes. You already had a. While ago, Robbie, So I didn't steal it from you. No, he didn't have an identity on offense, have an identity on offense. And and to piggyback some on on what Ben was talking about is within that identity. You can't be the offense that turns the ball over in your own territory. You got to make sure that you're you're taking care of field position, but you also need to to make sure that you're an offense that is efficient moving the ball down the field.

45:14 It doesn't get bogged down in these long periods of just looking completely inept, not leaning on the strengths of your offense and forgetting the weapons that you have on your offense. We we love to see Kyron out there doing Kyron things, but you don't have to run Kyron into a wall to to have an offense. We've we've got to have. We got other weapons out there. We need to lean on those other weapons and that's whether Kyron plays or not. I know we've got a bunch of questionable designations. Again, again, we don't really know what that means. You know, when they were probable, they didn't go. When they were questionable, they did and they probably shouldn't. So yeah, we'll, we'll see who lines up on Saturday for the Hokies at quarterback and running back. But whatever they do, we need to lean on the running, the rushing attack because that is the identity of this football team from an offensive standpoint.

46:07 Yeah, I'm going to throw a couple pieces in here. Some folks putting their thought processes up. Robbie again, office on the defensive side. Yep, Pressure, pressure, pressure. Hey, this is a big one. Oh, you grabbed one? I grabbed another one. Go for it. Yep, look at that. Didn't take long, did it? I see you out there, Chris. We see Chris Kelly been saying it like these guys that damn good, let them play. Josh Young. Yep, Josh, you had two on here because there you go. The only thing what's my key? Well y'all, we're freaking game 10 of this year and. We Curtis, hold on, hold on, hold on. Before you go with your with your I want no, I just want to say this so you can wrap it up when we talk about everything we talked about to the Hokie Keys shirt that we got sent, said 37.

47:00 Seven and. Then there's a question mark. These next two games are important. Very. The bowl game is important if you make it because you still can sell the program if that number is a certain number. You go with your you go with your keys are Curtis. I just want to say that. There you go, there you go. What do I do that? But like I said, we have played 10 games. This is game #11 as Dwight's putting on the screen there and I sit here and it's like I have no more hokey keys to give. Why? Because I've seen 10 games this year in an all 10. This team could have won every single one of them. Every single one of them.

47:46 People say, well, Clemson was no, they could have won that Clemson game. They could have. People can say, well, it was a shut up. They could have won that game. Look at the passion, how hard that defense was playing that game. Look at every game this year. And that's what irritates me as a fan because if we were five and five and we were an average team, it's last year, right? This is good. Hey, we're back on the right track. This is not an average team. This is an above average team with good players. How many Senior Bowl invites APR didn't get one. You know why APR didn't get one? Because APR is going in the 1st 2 rounds and those guys don't go to the Senior Bowl to get your stock numbers up. Don't need to they. Don't need to.

48:28 And that's what irritates me. And like when I say, what's the key play to your ability, coach to your ability, because if you do, you wipe the floor with Duke on Saturday night. And I know Ben, I love to having you here. But if the Hokie a game and the Duke a game both show up, the Hokies are winning by 17 points. The issue is we brought a bunch of C and a bunch of D games this fucking year and that's why we're five and five. And the bad part about it is a lot of those games, the season DS didn't show up until the last five minutes. Hey guys, did you know we were getting a Curtis rant? We needed it, holding it. It's been we had a we had a feisty Curtis who owned it and think about it. Yeah, we had a about week to kind of Stew on it and think about it and need you, right.

49:16 I mean, if you plan a team and they just better than you, you lose. It happens. Oh, we got to do better. We got to coach better. We got to play better. If somebody's hurt, don't fucking play them. Let them go to you. Put somebody else in. If they're on scholarship, they're on scholarship for a reason. Yeah. Don't put a running back in and never fucking run the ball. It makes no sense. That pisses me off. Yeah, real quick. I'm glad you put this up, Brian. On a very serious note, not only Gabe's, Gabe's leg injury by all means. That looks like that's just your normal injury.

49:57 He's going to be OK. If y'all were not aware Gabe put it up young man. I consider close to his podcast. When he first committed we got to interview him. It was awesome. We communicated with the numerous times his father fell significantly I'll after he got hurt his father as of the other day and somebody might have to keep this up because if anything has changed, his father was in very serious condition down at Roanoke Hospital. So, you know, Stephen, thank you for putting that in there. Do you know, say a prayer, forgave his whole family as they go through this time because that's, I know, you know, no one gave in his passion, You know, that comes from somebody in the family. And it's very likely his dad about how much he loves the sport and everything.

50:44 So yeah. I mean talk, talk about a, a, a very composed and mature person. Damn. When when we spoke with him, I mean, but definitely well beyond his years in terms of his composure and his passion for the game and, and just his ability to kind of understand kind of where he fits in the puzzle and, and, and the drive and, and like you said, that that's got to come from somewhere. So, you know, prayers up to him and prayers up to his family, you know, for, for healing during this time, man, because that was that was definitely a, a, a big struggle. And I'm, I'm hoping that he's, he's making some progress. His dad is and obviously Gabe with the with the surgery, you know, on his leg there so.

51:33 Yeah, Chris just put in the chat, put that up. Chris just put in the chat. He said that his dad's doing better and Gabe had a successful surgery today, so that's awesome. That's great to hear man. Appreciate it, Chris, for keeping us updated. Yeah. Definitely, definitely that. And like I said, man, I mean, of course, prayers up for his family, prayers up for the young man while we on here talking about coaching and playing and things like that. This is also what sports is about. Not people being hurt, but coming together after a tragedy, you know, and that is a is a big thing, a huge thing for that young man to go through. And when we talk about him being composed and mature, he was the one who came online and put, you know, hey, this is what's going on with my family.

52:23 Hey, hokey nation, can y'all, you know, pray for us and, and keep us lifted up. So to have that mindset and to know he has a, you know, know, he has a outlet that he can turn to and a community he can turn to is big. You know what I'm saying? Because some people feel like when stuff like that bad happens, they have nobody. So for all the bad things that we talk about on the field and what it is, I know that hokey nation's got the back. I know that God's got the back. So keep setting them up, man. Keep on praying. Keep on, you know, uplifting these players, especially during times like that. So whoever put that up, thank you because that definitely needed to be said. And I had forgot all about it when we started to get into the podcast, just rolling through things that we're talking about, rolling through things in our life. So whoever put that up, man, thank you so much for that. Steve, appreciate yourself.

53:22 Let's go here. We got to make predictions whether we feel good or bad about them, but we got to do them. Shelton, I'm going to let you kick it off cuz you are going to the game. You will see it in living color. In living what? Do you think happened Saturday night? Great. For whatever reason, I think tech will win. I'll take Vt 24 to 20. I think they'll get a little bit bounce back. Rest off the bye week. I think Drones will play have kind of mentioned him pretty well and Tech will escape with a close W for the first time since the 2022 Liberty game. Jesus, 3 two years to the day tally. What about you? I was going to go first because I I know Shelton like most of the time I'm like, why you make me go 1st and being Shelton goes after.

54:10 But I was going to go first because I want people to think I was copying it because like while being was talking, I was actively changing my my prediction on the rundown and I'm going Hokies, I'm going Hokies. I think we get a 10 point win this week. Being disconnected from football for about two weeks was great, but I still didn't like have time to myself. But here and being talk, being thank you again for coming on. I think that we match up well with them. I don't know if Kyron will be healthy enough to play, but I do know we have a capable backup and I think our defensive play inspired enough to get us to some things and get us in some positions. It's going to be positive for us. And what I forgot about was people's legacy game. Let's go.

55:04 That's a good. Point. That's a good point. I forgot about the People's Legacy game. I like that. I like that. I'm going 2720 good guys here. I think this is the first time that me, Tally and Sheldon have picked the Hokies in a long time. I know Tally was was trying not to break the streak there with the picking against the Hokies when they when they started winning, but that's that's burned now. That's burned now. Burned that to the ground. So I'm going 2720 good guys. I much like Tally. I think we match up well. I think their defense is good, but I think we'll be able to to do some things to to move the ball down the field. And I I think our defense is going to play well in this one. I don't think that they're they're going to burn us on on 3rd down like some other teams have. And I and I don't think that they're going to be able to run the football as effectively as they will need to to be effective in this game.

56:04 All right, Well, well, well, you know, Leave it to me, huh? You got to. Beaver, you got to leave it to me, huh? Bring it home, Curtis. Let's go. Bring it home. Well, you know what? I'm much like Tally. I was leaning the other way and hearing Ben talk and Ben gave some good information. But I think the Gabe Williams thing, forgetting about that and then being reminded of it, I think it's going to be a rallying cry for this team. And I do think they go down to Durham. I think they take care of business. And I'm agreeing with Shelton on here. I think this is going to be the first time in two in two years.

56:45 I think it's two years to the day if somebody gives that because it's it's damn close if it's not. The math is mashing. It's going to be within a couple days if. It's not. It's the same week, two years to the day Hokies take this 1/28/20 Effectively that is A1 score game. Technically, that's a one score game. Pride, pride gets off on the hook 2820. Hope he's come back. Gabe Williams rally cry and letting some of these young guys eat. So there we go. There are our predictions. Got a few people throwing them here. Got Steven and we'll throw you up here. There we go, Josh, Saying that I'd love to see some other predictions as we get up here, as we move on.

57:31 And as everybody knows, by the way, y'all know, we got back-to-back 8:00 games. We do. They just made the announcement well yesterday about the UN feel. About that, I don't know how I feel about that. I'm gonna be nervous. I'm gonna be nervous all day. Nervous all day? Yeah, all day. Like I said, I can enjoy it like the nerves getting married me. As you all know, we are brought to you by the Count Stanley Pharmacy, your friendly neighborhood pharmacy, Three O 1 S Main St. in Blacksburg. He leads. It's in every Tuesday night when we're here. So normally we do know the enemy would get over to big screens. We talk about the games.

58:12 But since we've been a lot of pissed off the last few weeks, we really haven't had a chance to talk about some other dealings in college football, primarily College Football Playoff. And I know that's going to be a sore subject for some people, but still, I still love college football. I still watch college football. Even though when I'm pissed on Saturday nights and I'm listening to tally ran on a on a space occasionally, I'm usually still watching football and I have all my screens up here. It's just what I do. So we wanted to talk about it. And here's the first thing I wanted to bring up to all three of y'all. There were certain media members that swore to God this is going to make games matter less.

58:55 People aren't going to care as much. Well, first of all, I think they're wrong. But what about y'all? How are y'all feel? Do you feel because of the playoff that it makes games matter less? No, I don't. I definitely don't think it matters less. I think people are tuned in every week like they always have been and I feel like the college playoffs along with the transfer portal brings in some chaos. You know kind of what college football needed because we were getting to the point where you feel like this team, team mate, team B, team C and Team B are going to be at the finish line every year. Occasionally you had you flip flop a couple of them, but that top six teams to 8 teams, you thought that's all we'll see at the end of the year and there's no way for anybody to catch up with them. Well, this year you got people watching teams like BYU or Colorado.

59:53 You know, you got team, you got, you got SMU, you got people watching other teams as a, as a collective to see if this team makes it, will they pair up with them if this team pairs up with a? Blank. How does that look? So no, I don't think it makes it, you know, less meaningful. I think it makes it more enjoyable for somebody like us. It fucking sucks sometimes. But as a college football fan, I think it may. I think it, I think, I think it's done what it's supposed to do. Sheldon, you were in agreement with Tyler. I can see you shaking your head. Why do you feel this way? Well, I, I just think it's, it's at a lot more excitement. It makes it so that you know, if you lose one or two games, maybe in three, your season isn't over. You can still compete for a conference title. You can still compete for in that large bid. I would say for me, I, I get kind of annoyed by the anti playoff discourse because you know, I I'm someone who grew up watching FCS football and the FCS. Playoffs is like. 2014 So for me it was always like, well, how is it that that the FCS can have an expanded playoffs, D2 can have playoffs, D3 can have playoffs, but the FBS shouldn't have playoffs.

1:01:02 Like it just doesn't make any sense to me. So I, I think I think having the 12th team playoff wasn't necessary expansion. You know, it'll probably expand more in the future, but I just think having it at 4 was just so limited. There was only a handful of teams that realistically, realistically could compete for a title. And I also think it may recruiting a little bit more concentrated at the top because you know that there's, you know, if recruits, you know, know that the only four teams can play for a title. It's more likely you want to play for a big school and and Al as well. I mean, guys get paid so you can go to different schools, transfer portal, you can leave them everyone. I think there's been a lot more, a lot more competitive balance. Yeah, you you went from having, you know, 6 to 10 teams in play for the major recruits because those are the teams that had a realistic shot at competing for that four team playoff. Now you got 12 spots.

1:01:49 You've got really probably 20 to 25 teams that at any point in the season had a legitimate shot. So you're you're spreading that wealth around. I mean, and I agree, but I'm saying minimum 252025. So you're, you're spreading that out a little bit. And when, when you look at what we have here, I, I, I just, I love this because I mean, when we look at just the SEC, right? So how many times have we put Vandy on a big Screener? Because they're, they're kind of playing upset dog at the SEC this whole damn year. And they're giving every team that has a number next to their, their, their name a run for their damn money week in, week out until they ran up against South Carolina. And that was the first team that I've seen really put Vanderbilt away in a this whole season, you know, one way or the other, right?

1:02:41 They definitely kind of been a team that's played to their competition throughout the season. But it it's making those games interesting because you you've got these teams that have played well, that can play spoiler. You've got so many other. It's like, it's like poker, right? You got a lot more outs when when you're looking at this. So there's a there's a lot more of a domino effect with a loss and there's a lot more of a domino effect putting yourself back into contention with a really good win. So it's it's making games more interesting in November and it's making more games more interesting in November and not just those handful that are taking place in one or two conferences where the the conference championship is still undecided.

1:03:23 I know what else I think, go ahead, Curtis, go ahead. I'm going to say this and I'll get it back to you, Tally. We have picked six games this week for big screeners. Every single one of the games we have has playoff implications. Every single game. And there's more. Their games we didn't pick that have implications. Go ahead, Tally. I was just going to say 2 and it comes down to kind of what you want it to be about is the players. You know what I'm saying? Like when you look at a player like Gente, right? So I've heard more high school students talk about him this year. Of course, he's having a great year. But when you have a committee that looks at a team, it's kind of like what they do with the the March Madness. If a player is hot and his team is starting to get hot, you kind of want them to be in that playoff discussion because that's going to bring views, you know what I'm saying? So for the players to be able to put their skills on display, it's a possibility to get them to the next level, which is the playoffs.

1:04:33 So I've absolutely loved what it is to have the expansion. And I'm kind of like Sheldon said, I mean, when you look at D2D3, even go into high school, then you go into pro, like there's been a playoff. So this wasn't a foreign thing. Everybody who's a football fan grew up with it. And then when you got here, you just accept it. This is the teams that we want to see. This is the teams that you should watch. No, we want to watch some of them. Other teams too. We want to see can, you know, the the underdog beat the beat the, you know, the top dog. So exciting, exciting man. All right, I'm I'm going to do a couple things here because I'm the one that wrote the question.

1:05:16 All the media said it wouldn't matter. They're fucking wrong. And I love it because now they got to go back and somehow turn back around and say, well, and no, you were wrong right Now, do you all know how many teams that have at least a chance to make the playoff? Just just guess how many teams that they're mathematically saying are not eliminated yet. 32. Not that many. That 32 was probably last weekend. Yeah, it's 23. There are 20. Three teams that can still make the playoff. This is the next to last week of the regular season and there's 23 teams that can make the playoff. And and I'm going to come from a Hokies perspective because as we rolled into November, y'all, we were like, listen, we just keep winning.

1:06:03 You just keep winning games and you just get to Charlotte right now. That's why we're probably more pissed off because we go lose to Syracuse and it's like that irritated you and it's like, well, now more shit's got to happen. But but think about this for all of us, not the best season, right? Five years ago, well, maybe we win the ACC, but we ain't going to playoff. We ain't got no chance to win a national title. And I know some people will say, well, nobody has a chance to win this little title. Hush about that. But at the beginning of November, we literally sat here and said if we can just win, we have a chance. That's all you got to do. You just got to give people hope.

1:06:43 And there's still 23 teams that have hope out there. And I'm hoping in the near future we're one of those 23 teams at this late in the season where it's just like, keep winning, get to Charlotte, get in Shelton. You have something you want to discuss that kind of piqued your interest. So I'm going to let you kind of leave this next little section here. Yeah, so we obviously, you know, if you're on Twitter chronically like me, I saw a lot of discourse about the SEC. Some people, it seems like a lot of the media, the media people are, are trying to hype up the SEC that are pro SEC. And that's led to some inevitable pushback because people are saying, well, you know, why should an undefeated or 1 less Indiana team be left out of playoffs in favor of, you know, 3 or 4 SEC teams? And there's been kind of a back and forth. I will say I, I I see a lot of people really misinterpreting stats and kind of making some bad arguments. As much as we'd like to show in the SEC, and believe me it is fun, they have objectively been the best conference this year in football by almost any metric, like advanced metrics. They have the best win percentage overall in non conference.

1:07:47 They've got the best win percentage against power four teams. So I do, I do think two things can be true at one time. I think the SEC can be the best conference in football, but we don't need to hype it up too much and it needs to be a case by case basis. I don't think Indiana, if they finish eleven and one and don't make the the big 10 championship game, there's no reason they should be left out, especially with how good their their metrics are. I know they played a bad schedule, but they've still got a a few decent wins and at some point like the games have to matter on the field. So I just wanted to kind of get that, get that off my chest. Yeah. I mean, you got to look at strength of schedule, but you also have to look at, like you said, the games and also the losses. Like, you know, if losses still have to matter, and we had this discussion last year, we're having it again this year.

1:08:32 You still need to have take into account the games that are played on the field, who won, who lost, what are the common opponents. You got to still look at those things as well as just the raw strength of schedule and and whatever metrics are are feeding into that. So I'm I'm, I'm with you, I do. I definitely think the SEC is the strongest conference out there, but I don't think it is this head and shoulders monster, especially compared to a big 10. But even more so, I think, you know, they're, they're still on the, you know, not, not a, a big jump from, you know, a Big 12 that's having a pretty good year. And you know, you look at an SMU that's that's, that's played some really good football as well.

1:09:15 So I mean, there's a, there's a lot of opportunities out there for these teams that I think compared to getting, you know, four, in some cases five teams from the SEC in this thing. Cal, you got anything you want to say on this or I go off? No, man, I'm good. I'm gonna pass it on to you. He's gonna pass it on to me. He don't want to because they, because they know where he works at down there, y'all? That's why he's got to keep it quiet sometimes. I agree the SEC is the best conference, but I keep going and this is what I'll always say. Wins and losses have to matter. Well, you know, they're a great three loss team. It's like they lost three games. They lost 1/4 of their schedule. That has to matter. I don't care what's tough.

1:09:58 There's some tough loss. I don't get shit. You lost, I don't care. Losing games happens, it continuously happens. It tells some about your team regardless of competition or not. Like right now the discussions Ole Miss is currently in, Ole Miss likely LSU is not. Is it probably an average team? I'm sure Sheldon could pull up the data and Kentucky is a below average team and they lost at home and on the road to those teams. So why are they considered a temple? They beat Georgia, so they're one win overcomes 2 not so great losses, like it wasn't a great loss like right, No losses have to matter.

1:10:44 And by all means, if you want you want to see like somebody like me catch hell, let Indiana get left out at 11 and one Robbie's putting on there. He thinks there there's going to be a three loss SCC team that gets left that gets put in over them. So that's where you let's. Let's say this and I'll and I'll, I'll, I'll let you finish if you need to finish there, Curtis. But go ahead. Let let's let's tell you where I'm at. So let's pretend that we we reset the last two last three weeks, right? We go back to pre Syracuse, we go up to Syracuse. We take care of business, we take care of Clemson at home. We run the table against Duke and UVA. We're sitting at 3 losses. We're going to Charlotte because things fell the way they needed to fall for us to go there.

1:11:29 I as a hokey fan would say if we don't win this fucking game in Charlotte, we do not belong in this mother fucker. No, I'm with you on that 100% there's. There's teams with a similar win, loss and and and strength of loss as a Vandy loss, a Miami loss and a Rutgers loss that people are putting in this conversation. So that that's where my problem was. There you go. So yeah, that's where I am again. I do think the SEC is the best conference. I think 4 is their number. I think 5 would be one too many in this case. All right, I know some of y'all got to see it, Some of y'all didn't. They did release the playoff standings and here are the four first game matchups.

1:12:17 If it were to happen today, I want to know which one intrigues you the most. Everybody listen up. So the first game we've got BYU traveling to the Horseshoe, playing Ohio State, Georgia, and the Penn State Happy Valley in the middle of December, where the high is 36�� as a average. Alabama would head to Notre Dame, also another state where the high is 35��, and then oldmouth to Indiana, similar. Which of those game intrigues you? Whoever wants to start. I mean, I'll, I'll start Georgia going to Penn State for a a night game whiteout in December.

1:13:02 Like 8��. Yeah, that, that that to me would be a very intriguing matchup. So yeah, count me, Count me in favor of that one. Tally What about you? Yeah, it's kind of, you know, that game, of course, just because I think just me watching, I think Georgia's the best team. I think they can beat anybody but Alabama. But you put in those conditions, you know, and things do change a little bit. But also you talk about like Obama, Notre Dame matchup, you know, like just a historical piece of it. I think last time they played we had a fake girlfriend and all that type of stuff.

1:13:48 So 12 years ago, yeah. Yeah, things like that, man. And all the. And I tell you, shout out. Yeah, man, when you got all that kind of stuff, looking at it, it it's it's very intriguing. But I mean, the Georgia, the Georgia and and Penn State is probably the most intriguing to me just because of how I feel about Georgia's team. What about you, Shelton? Yeah, I feel like Georgia playing PSC would also be like a a fever dream. Just doesn't feel just kind of feels weird. But I don't know, I mean, looking at it, I would say that's probably the the most hypothetically intriguing matchup I saw. Well, it's not a question that Boise State could get a buy, in which case they play the winner of BYU Ohio State, which would be also kind of crazy.

1:14:41 So I don't know, man, I, I, I'm just, I like that there's a, a competitive balance of teams like BYU has, you know, a good shot and, and Boise and all these teams, Indiana, like, I mean, I'm something like, you know, interesting matchups. I like teams that haven't played each other historically, teams that don't make sense geographically, teams that maybe aren't historically a great program, just kind of throwing them all together in this big, big pot and just, you know, seeing what all the crazies that happened. So I'm going to be, I'm going to be entertained by the way. Yeah, that's going to be the best part of it is. Robbie thinks Indiana or paper Tigers man. Put up what? What? What, Jim said. James Gilmore put up there. You put it up there a few minutes ago. Them boys from Ole Miss going to be stuck to the bleachers.

1:15:22 They ain't going to know how to move in like 7�� weather. That's that's one of the big things people aren't taking into account is when if a if a southern team Callie mentioned in in the state of Alabama, it's in the 50s in in the middle of December. It's nice not game of Notre Dame. It's like 8��. There's kids that ain't never seen below 40�� in that place. But for me, Brian, let it off. It would be Georgia at Penn State, because I think that would be an A the scene would be unbelievable and to be for real. I think like you said, tally Georgia is one of it's probably the best team.

1:16:04 I think they're the only to me, they're the absolutely the only deserving two loss SCT men. You can like they they're deserve to be in. They deserve to be in over anybody else. But I think with that said, everybody still shitting on Penn State, Penn State does a couple different things in the red zone. They beat Ohio State. It's not like that. That gap was so far. Like it wasn't like it was a 28, seven game. It was literally a touchdown game that game. So I think that's the most intriguing. Obviously this is going to change. Obviously when it does, we will be talking about it a little bit more. I think it's been decided. I think is everybody pretty much of the first eight, first four teams, Georgia right now is the one that can make the run. I.

1:16:52 Don't think so. It's, it's either Georgia or Ohio State. I, I don't really trust any of the other ones with any with any great confidence. You know, the, the only thing I'd say is that, you know, when you look at Georgia, you know, right now they're going to probably be on the road unless things change in the next, you know, three weeks. But that's really the only thing that's probably handicapped in them week 1 is, is having to be on the road versus the other. The other teams that are probably in that discussion are playing at home. I'll actually go. I'll go out-of-the-box. I'm actually kind of a Georgia skeptic just because their offense has been kind of so schizophrenic.

1:17:35 I am actually a big believer in Ole Miss. I know that people cannot sleep on them because they, they lost two games, but metrically they have been pretty much a top five team in the country this year. You know, it's just those two losses to Kentucky by three and then LSU by three. Other than that, they have pretty much wiped the wiped the floor with everyone. So I, I think people are really sleeping on them. I think they're a really good team. They forgot to play offense for two weeks and. They didn't earn them and it cost them and it cost them big time, big time. By the way, everybody is like you said, Ohio State, Brian, that would be the scariest game. And I think the 512 is going to be the scariest game because if you're the 12 C, what do you have to lose? Like Kalani Sataki, if y'all ever watched him Coach B, he already does some funky things in games. Yeah, I mean.

1:18:21 You so tell you know what I'm talking about. He will throw curveballs. If you're a 12 and like you got to go high state, you ain't got a shot. Like we going to pull out every trick in the book. We're going to do funky stuff all night. Why not? Why not? And I think the year at 12 beats A5 and maybe that's the first year. It's going to be one of those things where we told y'all for years, settle it on the field with the damn Paper Tiger rankings because Brian Siegler loves pre rankings. All righty, let's move on. And we are going to get to our big screeners pick. Like I said earlier, every single game we have selected has massive implications on the playoffs.

1:19:04 Some are elimination games, some are effectively I'm trying to look at 1 here. One of those games could be played for a potential buy depending on what happened. So let's go to it. Brian Siegel, start us off Where are we going? We're going to Notre Dame, baby. We're going to South Bend. No, you're not. This game's in the Bronx. This game is in the Bronx, You're right. This game is in the Bronx. I forgot about this. So I like my pick even better than because Notre Dame's getting 14 points here and that seems like just a little too much.

1:19:51 I like what Arby's been doing this year, so I'm taking Army here. I think Notre Dame will win this game, but it's not going to be by two touchdowns. Yeah, I'm with you. Being in the Bronx, night game start, 7:00. Yankee Stadium. 14 is just too big a number to lay the way Army's been playing. If this had been like 10, I'd take Notre Dame because I think that's what they wanted by like 3121. But give me Army as well. I think, I think Navy's due for a big time cover. Excuse me, Notre Dame, sorry. I think, I think they'll cover pretty easily. They typically do pretty well at the service academies and I don't think this will be an exception today.

1:20:31 Same. Notre Dame, give them to me. He said give them to him. Miranda is going with us and Jason is going with us. So there we go. Big playoff implications, why Notre Dame wins out. Notre Dame's in Army this. If they get this victory, it could propel them potentially to be in right there and all they need is a Boise State slip up, a Boise State slip up and they're in. So there that is, I got the next one. I got the big game of the week. I got #2 versus #5 Indiana goes and visits the Horseshoe, the biggest game in Indiana football history.

1:21:14 There is not even a single doubt in my mind about this and they are getting 13 1/2 points versus Ohio State. I know Indiana does not have as much talent as Ohio State, I know that. But when it's 13 1/2 points in every good team that has come across Ohio State this year, they ain't exactly beat shit out of them. So I think 13 1/2 is too big. I think Ohio State wins. I think it's a hell of a lot closer than 13 1/2. I am taking Indiana to cover. Yep, I'm riding with you there.

1:21:57 You know it's it's 13 1/2. If you, if you gave me even 10 1/2, I might would have taken it, but the 13 1/2 that I can see this being a 13 pointer when it's all said and done. I know we got Robbie in here. Robbie is definitely thinks that IU is a big, big paper tiger right now. I, I don't, I don't, I don't feel that quite that way. I definitely think they're probably a little inflated relative to where their talent level is, but I think they're going to keep it close enough in this one. So I'll, I'll take the Hoosiers. Sheldon.

1:22:38 Yeah, I'm taking the Buckeyes. I think this is what I call a worst case scenario game for Indiana. I think they're going to get destroyed and that's going to start the discourse about if they should be in the playoff or not. So I could be hilariously wrong, but I think that's how it's going to play out. Tally yeah, I'm going to go Indiana on this one. I think that Ohio State wins, but I think that Indiana will cover. It's just too big a number. Miranda's riding with with Sheldon, and so is Jason. Split house on this one, it's just to me, it's just too big. And I've seen Indiana score. I've seen him in some low fights as well. Yeah. All righty, Shelton. Let's go.

1:23:25 This is this is going to be a cool game. So I think Arizona State is a program that people aren't really talking a lot about this year. They've had a great season, 8 and two kind of out of nowhere. But so too is BYU. So match of two really interesting Big 12 teams. I will take the Cougars to cover -3.5. Ron. Yeah, I'm, I'm, I'm with BYU here as well. I think they're going to go and handle business. It's really going to put them a very good place playoff wise. So I think they're going to go out there and take care of business. And that's despite ASU really having been putting together a a very unlikely season even relative to to BYU. I think BYU we thought was going to at least be a factor. I think ASU just kind of came out of nowhere. ASU comes out of nowhere, unranked in the playoff, 8 and two, BYU coming off a big loss to a surging Kansas team. But ASU coming off, I mean, we all got a bunch of us got the ASU game wrong last week with Kansas State. Brian, I'll let you find that for me. I'm with me and me and me and Josh are together on this one. Put that up here, that up here.

1:24:37 Which one? The storm and Mormons to cover because they're going to win the game outright. Yeah, I believe BYU too. You know, big loss last week. I mean, most of their players are probably 32 years old. And just like us, when you go to work, something bad happens one day at work. You just, you just go back the next day and do your job. You know, they they grown man. They got to go home and put the kids to bed. They ain't going, you know, they ain't going to get all upset about it. They're just going to come on back to next week and make something happen. So BYU. Yeah, Miranda's riding with BYU and Jason is the only one we. Got to be difficult.

1:25:23 Yeah, he's the only. One hanging there with with Arizona State. By the way, if y'all didn't know Robbie was here picking last week, probably win O 1/6. Shell, That might not bode well for that Ohio State pick. Exactly. All right, let's move on. Jonathan Talley, what is your game, my friend? My game is SMU versus UVA. The reason I picked this game is because again, SMU is in the hunt right now. And I mean Virginia's in the hunt as well.

1:26:05 They're trying to figure out if they're going to come to Lane Stadium and win and get into a bowl game. So it's going to be pretty interesting to watch watch this game. But I'm taking SMU because I think SMU is going to beat the dog shit out of them. I don't even, I don't even think Virginia cares for real. I think that they're just focused on if we get to Lane and we beat them because they're down, then we'll go to a bowl and whatever we'll sport that season. Yeah, I mean, we're, we're, we're hearing things like, you know, Calandria has been running the locker room and all this stuff. And I'm, I'm not, I'm not really sold on what, what UVA is, is doing down the stretch here. I think you're right, Tally. I think they are pretty much playing for the the Hokey Bowl at this point.

1:26:52 So I'm taking SMUI think they're going to roll. I don't think it's going to be close. I think it could be 3 scores. Oh yeah, I'm, I'm with you. This is SMU kind of had a struggle against Boston College. I watched a lot of that game. And and. Like we played Boston College, they had those moments against us, they had good moments against SMU and I think they're going to beat the dog shit out of them. I think this is going to be a get right game for SMU as they kind of get into the end of the season and net it towards the ACC Championship game. Yeah I agree, I just don't like to advise with UVA right now and I do think they're going to be overlooking SMU in favor of tech next week. So SMU big. Miranda, Miranda and Jason are riding across. Look at the Little Pony.

1:27:36 Go across the thing there. Look at that. We're colonial downs, man. We're Colonial Downs all righty so here we go. We got Miss Miranda. I almost picked this game because what Florida did beaten LSU a they got hope again there because they lost LSU and they're like we'll bring Bill and Napier back and like he just fucking lost another game fire his ass. But this is big for Ole Miss. We've already discussed Ole Miss of all the two lost teams, they have the most 2 unimpressive losses. If they go down to the swamp, lose this game, there should be absolutely no discussion.

1:28:18 I don't give a shit if they beat Georgia. That would be 3 losses. Yeah, but anyway, Ole Miss, Florida's getting 10 1/2. Brian, what are you thinking? I'm going Ole Miss here. I think this is going to be at least a 2 touchdown victory for the Rebels there. I I really don't like what I've seen out of Florida. I know they've had a couple games where they've looked a little better than they did kind of the start of the year, but I think it's still a very middling team and and a team that really struggles to kind of put four quarters together. So I'm going to take Ole Miss in this one. I'm taking Ole Miss too because much like what UVA is doing for SMU, Florida is licking their chops at play in Florida State next week because they know they're going to get to a bowl and they go absolutely beat the dog shit out of Florida State.

1:29:04 Ole Miss wins by 17. They keep the playoff folks alive. I think Florida's going to be in for a big time hangover, so I got Ole Miss. Give me all Miss Wayne gone. Do what he do, stay in his lane. Hey, back-to-back, back-to-back across the board. Across the board and see where we're wrong. All right, the one more game from the Music Man. He is traveling to Lawrence, where the Colorado Buffaloes are playing the Kansas Jayhawks. Buffalo Soldier Drilling Rasta, who bought the Buffalo Soldier in the heart of America storm from Africa and brought to America.

1:30:25 Yeah. Hey, welcome back to another week of guitar licks and gambling picks. I'm Jason Long. Now for today I'm going all the way back to my week one pick, which was of course the Buffaloes of the University of Colorado. Now how's their season been going? Pretty good. They probably hit it to the Big 12 championship game, maybe the College Football Playoffs. Chador's probably going to be the number one pick in this year's NFL draft. Travis Hunter's looking like the Heisman winner, and Coach Prime might even be headed to Dallas.

1:31:06 More on that in a moment. Now this week, Colorado's hit it to Kansas to take on The Jayhawks. And Kansas did have a big win this past weekend, but so did Colorado. And Colorado is currently only laying 2 1/2 points against Kansas. So I'm going to take Colorado -2 1/2 versus The Jayhawks on Saturday. But first, let me talk to Dion for a moment. Now, you're probably not going to hear this, but we do know you do follow social media stuff, so who knows. Rumor is you want to take that Dallas Cowboys job. Well, really, you really want to go back to Jerry World and deal with that clown show because it seems like you got a pretty good gig where you're at.

1:31:49 Colorado is a chill place to live. Queso Benito's back, the best player in the NBA, the Joker, and he's hanging out in Denver and, well, we've legal. So even when you lose, everybody's going to forget about it anyway. So you might want to think about it before you make that jump back to Texas. But don't take my word for it. There's another Colorado institution that has a song that, well, goes a little like this. This. Whole world is getting to me. There's no trust, no integrity. So I loaded. Up the kids, took the wife out of the home and I moved on out to Colorado farm hurting rice crops are all brownies. Those fries here sitting folks by the dog and that's cold beer bigger truck country and listen shit, we gotta tear and keep us warm.

1:33:00 Well, that's what you get on. Hey Dion, you do you, but I would stay in Colorado. Most importantly, let's go ahead and take care of Kansas, Colorado -2 1/2 this Saturday. I'll see you all next week. Jason put a lot of time and effort and thought into that recording a. Little 2 for one special too. One special Oh my God, I'm about crying over here, especially using a South Park song. All right, so it is Colorado getting 2 1/2 points against Kansas at Kansas. Brian Ziegler.

1:33:48 For every single reason that Jason just laid out, I'm going with the Buffaloes. Line of the year is weed is legal there, so even if you lose they're going to forget about it. Give me Colorado, they're not losing this one. They covered it 2 1/2 easy. Kansas has actually been one of the unluckiest teams in the country this year, which is why there were only 2.5 dogs to BYU last weekend. Turns out they won. So I I like, I like Kansas a lot better than some people do, but I just think Colorado has too much skill talent and they're going to they're going to find a way to win the game. Give me Colorado. Hey. Miranda and I would cross the ball.

1:34:28 That's. Three in a row, man. Three in a row, Oh Lord. Oh, there it is. There it is. There it is. Look at. The bottle work there a lot of sheeps a. Lot of sheeps. We're all sheeps. Hey, you got to give Jason some props here. This that ASU pick. He went out on the ledge. He did go out on the ledge there. Not. Not a lot of parody this week. Not a lot of parody fellas. Anything Additionally y'all want to add the 9 before we wrap this show up? I like. Gently for the Heisman. Gently for the Heisman, all right. I think if it's not Hunter, it's gently so. I like gently, man.

1:35:14 Ain't no lie, dude. But Hunter is just he's he's different. So we'll see. It'll be fun to see how it shakes out, yeah. Sometimes I need the junior to. Win a football game, that's what I need. I feel like Hunter is the the popular selection, whether it's going to, you know, go that way or not. Well, but he but he's doing it though. I mean, if he wasn't doing it, then you could say why. But he's making picks, he's making plays on the offensive side of the ball. You know what hasn't he done? Yeah, that's the whole piece. And and it's again, you know, the only 9. What is it? Woodson 27 years ago and Woodson did very minimal on offense that year.

1:35:55 Yeah. So I I think it's Hunter. The the only way it wouldn't be Hunter would be the following if the next three games, the next three games, because Boise I think is automatically in the Mountain West. If if Gente gets to 2500 yards and 30 plus touchdowns then because that's Barry Sanders type shit. Yeah. You know, somebody said he's on Barry's pace, like Barry went for 2600 and like 11 games. He is not on Barry's pace. That was, I mean, I was 5, but I can remember going back and reading that and it's like, how do you have 2600 yards in 11 games? Do that math. All righty.

1:36:37 All right, well, that is going to wrap up this episode of the Boundary Corner Podcast brought to you by Counts Family Pharmacy in Blacksburg. I'm Curtis Wilson. I'm Brian Siegler. Jonathan Talley. And I'm Sean Moss. We are part of the College Total Network. Check out our website, boundarycornerbt.com and listen to all of our episodes. Brian, did the person get in touch with you? They did not. OK, so we're going to give them one more week. Say the name again. Jonathan Harris Jonathan Harris 8975 is the user on YouTube. Please reach out to us. We've got a, we got a fun pyramid to send your way, but we need to know how to get it to you. If Jonathan Harris has not contacted us by the time Jason's song hits at the top of the program next week, he's void. Sorry.

1:37:32 If you're listening to this and it's 9:30 next Tuesday, you ain't got a You ain't got one sorry. So remember that we are going to going to redraw. So if you are one of those people that put your names in, Brian still got the thing set up. So all you got to do is press a button and we get another name again, Jonathan Harris. If you're out there listening, if you don't get to us by 9 PM when we pressed a button to go live next Tuesday night, which is going to be a fun one because I ain't working Wednesday, I might have a few drinking drinks here. I'm not working that whole damn week. I'm working Monday.

1:38:12 I got to clean up my e-mail. I got like 350 floating out there. I got to get rid of them. I can't deal with it no more. I got too many hours to take between now and end of the year. Yeah, Brian. Brian could take the whole month of Yeah, yeah, Brian's got all these days. He basically ain't working there. But anyways, go to Boundary Corner, go to Facebook, Instagram, YouTube. Appreciate y'all doing all that good stuff. Y'all know all the podcast forces we're on. Y'all know Jason plays us and plays us out. Check his website, jasonlongmusic.com out. It'll tell you where he's going to be playing down to the Roanoke area. Also all of his music stuff. We thank you all for listening, and as always, let's go. Please. The.