This week we invited Sons of Saturday scribe and co-host of the Basketball Conference and Hokie Hangover podcasts Mike McDaniel to our show. We discuss the Hokies positional depth heading into the 2021 season and address some areas where Coach Fuente and his staff need to improve the roster in order to be competitive in the ACC.

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0:45 Welcome back to the boundary Corner Podcast Thursday night, man, that thirsty, Thursday, Thursday, Thursday, buddy. We back at it again. Back at it again, it's Thursday. I think we can say Braun summer is officially here. I don't know, I think so. I think so we had a weekend there of rain and some cooler weather weather but turned around for us. I think we're looking pretty good, man. Absolutely. I mean this weekend looks great. Going to be like mid 80s. Probably hit the pool up one day. You know, get the kids outside. Have a lot of good phone about you. Well, hold on. Congratulations, Brian. Thank you gradually, folks, Brian this week, put a contract on a house.

1:33 Something he is, then he and his wife and his family have been working for last really year, man. And you texted me, like, I'm already like doing this. I'm like, ooh, Brian we get to design your man cave. Got the bank, a we got the double deck on the back, so I'm pumped, it's going to be a going to be a good time once we finally get in there. So closing, Probably by the end of the month. So looking forward to a buddy. Awesome. Whoops. Tonight, we're actually bringing on a special guest Mike McDaniel from the sons of Saturday's going to be joining us here in just a second and we are going to be looking at the Hokie depth chart given it some grades talking through it with Mike about where we're seeing what he's saying for this upcoming 20, 21 Seasons. So without further ado, Let's have Mike. Come on.

2:28 Hey Mike. How you doing tonight? Supports, we are having a good Thursday here. Good. Like I said I've got some drinks. Enjoying the nice weather we've had today. How about you got my bourbon just for the occasional gentlemen. Yes sir, here we go Mike that's really weird like currently good things with your Boston teams today the Sox took care of Houston 521 Bruins up 1-nothing. I got that in the Islanders on the TV here. Me too. Not a fun day, not a fun week for basketball. I don't. Yeah, don't even don't even get started, man. It was a, it was a brutal season for my Celtics. I was hoping that they put something together in the playoffs and then they before the first series happens or they are Jalen Browns out for the year. I'm like, all right, well, we don't have a prayer against the Nets and then all year, they have Kemba Walker resting on the second night of back to backs and they were like, all right, this is so he'll be ready for the playoffs, and you won't be hurt.

3:27 Hurt and lo and behold he gets hurt in the playoffs. I'm like, man if they had just played him on the second night of back-to-back. We probably avoid the Nets in round 1 but there you go. Yeah, all hell. Broke lose Inge retires and Brad Stevens is. Now president of basketball operations, I'm not even sure he's even qualified for so total mass. I've no idea what's going to happen and they just put a complete bomb to it once once everything went South, man. Oh yeah, I just I'm a die-hard Celtics fan, so it was really hard season for me. So wait a second, is the? So the Kendrick Perkins is the fake thing. I saw that in like it's Perkins even coaching immediately immediately check to see if he account was fake because I was like, wait a second. Kevin Curtis is now this is not right to not happen. Italy is not qualified for basketball Lobster, you tired, Kendrick Perkins as head coach.

4:19 So go get not only drinking bourbon just to have us a good time tonight. He's he's soaking a little miss Zuri. Yeah. I mean it's the waiting all week for that drink boys. There we go. It's all of us, man. I mean, hey, but hey like I told Brian before we you joined us summer is here. 8, being the highest confidence of where we feel all three of us and then we're going to talk about it. Look at depth things.

5:08 I see things Brian sees obviously things, Mike sees and let's let's jump right into it and let's start with these literally most important position. For the Hokies, you know, really since 1995. Let's start with the quarterback. Mike I'm going to let you have the honors since you are wearing your pilot's hat there, one through eight. What's your confidence level? First of all for the quarterback room depth-wise. All right. Well I mean this is a lot of this depends on you know the health of Braxton Burmeister because if he gets hurt prophets plummets and Not if it's, when voice right look for.

5:52 See a lot of quarterback Powers, man. I get it, like, I get it. They're trying to put weight on them and, you know, they, he wants to be, you know, in a better spot health-wise so that he can carry a brunt of the load at the quarterback position. And we know Brad cornelison loves to run his quarterbacks. I just man, I am nervous about it, man. I'm nervous about it. I just, I think Burmeister is a Capable quarterback. You know, I think when he was healthy towards the end of last year, we saw what he was capable of. Certainly had a really good game against UVA. He's very athletic can run very well. I was surprised at how, well, he threw the ball.

6:33 The last couple times, we saw him last year and I'm willing to chalk up the beginning of the year and his struggles to you. No one being kind of thrown into the fire or two. We knew he was banged up, he was banged up in Fall camp and then he's playing a bit hobbled. And thrown into kind of a tough situation there. And you know what, I think just was honestly Justin Fuente as quarterback going into the year last year. It's not something I believed at the time but it's something that you know as the year went on you know I feel like if Burmeister was a little bit more healthy. I think that Fuente would have considered going back to him earlier than he did handed hooker. Did not have a good year last year and I love tendon hooker.

7:14 I like when Burmeister displaying early and you know, it was clear, he wasn't Right. I was thinking, man, it we got to get hooker back and then, you know, understood that with the covid, everything else? You know that was the reasoning behind him, not playing early in the year and I just I like Burmeister. I think he has an opportunity to play. Well, if he's able to stay on the field, I give this a confidence of like a for though, like right in the middle because I feel like there is upside there, but I am very concerned because the depth is just not where it needs to be Knocks kadem. Admirable effort against Clemson. He's not a power. Five quarterback, at least not in the starting capacity. Connor blumrich wasn't even a quarterback at A&M. I don't know what they're even doing there. He can't be really considered a legitimate that piece in my opinion.

8:03 I mean he wasn't playing quarterback and am he was moving all around the field and then didn't see him as a quarterback. I'd get they had Kellen Monde but you know, if he's not even capable the backup role there, why is he a backup at Virginia Tech and Taj Bullock is true freshman like yeah there's a true freshman especially one that wasn't here for spring practice. It wasn't like Bullock was an early enrollee if he was I could see them. Maybe turning to him. But the fact that he's not coming on campus until really like right now makes it really hard for me to imagine that he has a role plus he's a little bit raw. You know what I mean? And you know Josh Jackson. You guys remember when Fuente first got here Josh Jackson came in.

8:48 And was a legitimate Contender for a starting quarterback as a true freshman, you know, which Rod Evans and there was an opportunity for him to for him to play Early. Obviously did play early as a redshirt freshman earlier than I think. We all thought, yes, we can pick Evans was coming, was going to come in and then leave after a year, but, you know, 20 is not afraid to play young guys. I just don't think Bolick is going to be in that situation to play early, so it's it's going to be dicey if and when Burmeister dead It's hurt because it's track record of staying healthy. Is obviously not very good. Yeah, I'm actually a little more pessimistic than you at this position and it starts and ends with Braxton Burmeister is Health. Yep.

9:30 Because as much as we run the football with the quarterback quarterback Powers, other design runs and then some of our play calling in the passing game, gives the opportunity for the quarterback to take off a lot. So I just I don't feel All comfortable about his health and I feel zero confidence with pretty much everybody behind him more than you know, spot duty to like finish a game or something like that. I feel like Doc's could to do okay in that capacity but if he's starting more than one game, I mean it's a rap. I mean that's that. That's not what you want to see. I'm giving that that that's going to be my lowest grade is good. Grade one there solely because I don't trust Braxton's health and I feel like we don't have anything to inspire confidence behind him.

10:17 What are we gonna do? That I'm with Brian. It's a one that we're we're going to have to literally go triple option offense, if Braxton gets hurt, and run the ball, 65 times of game and same kind of Bloomberg, run the show from like, listen, listen, listen, the only reason I gave it a great as high as I did is because I'm thinking optimistically saying he'll start more than we expect. If that's not the case. What you're saying? He at least gets a full, eight games. You're Least a full eight games played games, give me give me two thirds of the schedule and what's this? Hey, that guy's we would take that one we.

10:58 Yeah, I mean yeah, monitoring this situation. Yeah, I take a full eight games and maybe, you know, at least half of to others. The only misses two full games we can deal with that. Maybe. Yeah, low confidence. No confidence. We're super low confidence because it's nothing behind it. Well actually, Himself. He used to, if you told me Braxton played 12, games fully healthy at the levels, we saw him near the end of last year. I feel super good about the room. Definitely, what I don't feel confident is. If you guys both mentioned it, it's a propensity to how we run the quarterbacks you can't, and you can't run Braxton General because he's not built like Gerard or Josh or Hendon or Quincy.

11:44 He is a smaller built guy fast. Don't get me wrong. Like I think I remember the first time he pulled in that NC State game and he took down that left side, it was just like, whoa, like he's like not only is he had made that decision quickly but when he gets his third step, he's gone. It's not a build-up, you know, Quincy had to be A build-up. Hendon was about a five step guy, but it's the Connor Bloomer of thing like how hard they went after it seeing it made no sense. Like you needed to be finding someone at a lower power 5, or lower power, 5 level or a G5 level that had started some games to be F.

12:24 And it's the biggest not me and Brian talked about a lot sometimes owner, sometimes off the roster management of this staff. In general is terrible. Yep, it's terrible. And as we get into some of these other spots, probably all three of us. We're we're ranking our confidence. You're going to see that reflect. So I think we're going to get to it at the very next one, actually. Yeah. We are optimistic or pessimistic cartax and Brian and one optimistic. The craziest part about that is my optimism is like our middle grade, you know.

13:08 That's that's where the optimum best case scenario. Hey, I'm in, I'm an optimistic guy. Guy. But I'm a thousand percent with you guys as far as what the concerns are. There's no doubt about that. By the way, for the listeners and for you guys, you wonder what I was doing with the towel. Mike. Your statement made me spit my berry out. So I'm trying to clean it up here off the desk and start early. Exactly. So let's go next let's take a look. At the offensive line room. Mike, I am going to kick this to Bryant is a Brian is our resident offensive? Lineman here. Brian. What's your confidence? Great. This just behind quarterback at it too and it could have been a one if we would have had any semblance of a backup quarterback.

13:54 I feel okay about potentially the first five guys we have meeting to new de Les of the Smith, probably Johnny Jordan, some combination of Brock Hoffman and Silas and see. Right Guard tackle, depending on where they end up, flopping. Them beyond that, like zero confidence. Absolute, no confidence, you got Jesse Hansen, who we haven't, really heard a lot from kind of is not. I wouldn't say underachieve but hasn't really hit the potential. I think some people thought for him you got two young guys in Parker Clements and Caden more. And then you got Bob, shit coming in as a as a Jew. Zuko and outside of that, like, it's just, it's just some guys like it's scary hours.

14:50 And and even that second line is, is a scary thought more than like a, as we said, with quarterback more than having to, you know, finish out a game or maybe have a plug start for somebody. Some guy that goes down for one game, like anything, more than one game is scary. Tyrell, Smith's damn near 30. We had to get him out of retirement. Have back and he's never really started a game in offense of line. I mean, it's really been special teams guy, for most of his time and that says, all you need to know about the depth. I mean, I'm, I'm at like a two or three. It's, I want to be optimistic and say three but I feel like it's about a to like here's the thing, I'm with you Brian, like the offensive line as currently constructed with the Five Guys that we presume will be starting.

15:37 I'm actually, okay with I'm a little bit concerned about Luke tenuta, moving to the left tackle. I understand it now. It's, you got to make that move. I get it. He's our best. He's your best tackle. You gotta play in there. I totally understand it. He just kind of had a so-so year last year, right? Tackle. So now moving in the left tackle, McMahon, is he really ready for that? He's got a lot of upside and I think he's a good lineman. I'm just a little bit concerned about him there and that's why the confidence level is lower. Because I feel like he is one of our better offensive lineman and I do have a concern about him at left tackle. The see this myth? I think we'll be fine. I mean I think he's going to be our most consistent offensive. Lineman Johnny Jordan's going to play center and then Brock Hoffman sliding over is probably what's best.

16:22 But my patience with Brock Hoffman ran thin last year for all of the ridiculous Antics. After the whistle. It's like, dude, you are, you are a good lineman you are. Not an outstanding lineman that we can't. So outstanding that we can't pull you out of the game. When you're acting like an asshole, like you can't be committing. I mean, some of the penalties, he's committing. It's just like, man. They teach you this and this guy's been playing football since he was, you know, yay, high. You can't be committing the penalties that he was committing and high leverage situations like he was last year. Like he's got an absolutely clean that up or else. You got to find somebody else. Who's going to play?

17:03 Who's not going to commit penalties like that again? Good Weinman. But not so good that you can't pull them off the field when he's acting like that. So he's got to clean that up. I'm really optimistic about Johnny, Jordan, its Center, you know, all-big ten type player really started to come into his own at. Maryland has an opportunity to be really good here. I think and then Silas antsy, I mean, I'm okay with him playing some I just You know, he's probably going to be our most inconsistent offensive lineman and I'm really concerned about the depth, I mean the the depth the offensive line is what's troubling me. I mean the only reason why it's a little bit better than quarterback as you get more guys to try different positions but that's that's really about it.

17:46 I mean other than that it's a lot of unproven Jeff back there. You hope you got. Jesse that can play a couple different positions which is that's really the only saving grace or at this point is that you know, Jesse can probably play. Behind Smith and behind Jordan, while brought kind of works on the right side depending on areas of need. But outside of that, I mean it's it's like you said, it's scary in the depth area Curtis, I'ma let you go ahead Ben. Well, I mean, what I will you kind of said, what I was going to say but the other piece is if we were to look back 365 days ago and I told you guys, hey next year, offensive line depth is going to be scary. Y'all would have a laughed at me said I was an idiot.

18:30 Based on what we had. So once again it's the roster management but I'm going to Pivot this quick back to you Brian because Mike I want you to listen to Brian's idea and to me you talk about Silas being inconsistent. I'd rather him be inconsistent at guard and tackle and Bravo. Yeah Prime pitch an idea you talked to me the other day about what you'd like to do on the right side of that line. I mean think I think it would be best if Brock and play right tackle. If that would agree, that would be something that could work out. Silas. You can hide the biggest deficiencies that he has inside. Yes, you can and I think you'll do better in the running game there as well. So moving him down. I think would be the best case scenario so long as Brock and hold up outside.

19:15 Obviously he's seems like played pretty much every position on the line. At some point in his football, career played guard and Center, obviously when he was at Coastal, Then, you know, we've been kind of working him at both positions with Center being the primary in terms of actually playing in a game, but I would like to see him slide out. If we can make that work that gives us the chance to probably put our best five linemen on the field at least to start things off there and then see what goes there. And obviously I've only looked at a little tape on Bob Sheikh. He looks like he's a fairly decent player but I don't nothing spectacular, you know? The mechanics, but nothing that blows you away and obviously hasn't done it at the power 5 level yet. So you really don't know what that's going to look like. Yeah, so I mean when you're relying on those step pieces, that haven't played the position at the power 5 level before and you have two starters transfer out of the program, you have another one, go to the NFL.

20:20 It's again the roster management is what really bothers me because I feel like we really should have been the port. Oil and hitting the portal hard for offensive lineman, when the coaching staff comes out in Spring practice and I sit in, I sit in on those press conferences and they're saying in those press conferences, that offensive line depth is a serious concern when they're saying that in the spring. This again, guys, this is a coaching staff that has done everything in their power, Brian. And I were talking about this before we hit record, they do everything in their power, not to reveal their hand right? When they're coming out and openly saying, Extremely concerned about the offensive line that makes me nervous.

21:02 Exactly, really nervous when they're open about their not open about anything. They're gonna be open about that. Come on now. Well, you talk about having your hand. It's like, you they were drunk at the card table that turned over their hand. Once once Hudson and Nestor left assumes, they love you. Nude aerosol was gone. Daryl saw, was that good of a player? You knew was going and as soon as though, kids transfer it out, everybody can look and say they're gonna be weak on the offensive line. I'm just a tattoo as well and then you sit here and there's nothing behind it. There's no, there's no attacking the portal. Talk about Bob ship potentially coming in, maybe he comes in because at least he is 65 at 300 pounds.

21:43 There's his upside, his upside is, he has a body already that is essentially ready to play. Maybe he has some good enough technique and fundamentals, where you say, okay, we are going to move Brock outside chicks, going to back him up. This will give us a little Room flexibility on the inside with Silas and Jesse kind of play in the swing guard spot now. But again, it's the whole thing of what happened to Johnny, gets bang for three games. Well, you moving Brock inside? Yeah, you're either shit. Your silence outside, where it's like, at least you talked about, Luke. The new to, at least Loop to Newt is good enough. You know, schematically you could do things to give him help on the left side, whether it be keeping the tight ends in chipping shifting to that side. but if you have two outside guys, who both need help, I mean, what are you going to do?

22:35 You're going to sit out there and just run power all day and just say, hope to God, we can get 3 to 4X protect everything, man. Yeah, two-man routes all day. Yeah, the absolute key to this offensive line having a successful years. The interior guys staying healthy. I mean, we can't can't afford to have an injury Ajani, Jordan Brock Hoffman because even if they were to bounce Brock Hoffman outside, if they have an injury inside, they can move them, right? Now if you gets, if he gets hurt, I think your options are a little bit more limited, our list of where you're playing him inside or out. Yeah, absolutely absolutely person. So as we have kicked off the first two position groups here. Our confidence levels are not that high for the offensive line for the quarterback room.

23:20 So let's move to the next room. We're staying on offense, will flip the defense in a little while here folks, let's look at the running back room and I'm going to be straight up with you. I put the running back room at a Because there's so many guys there, someone is bound someone's gonna hit. Apparently it ain't whether he's Sean King markedly, you know, maybe one of the guys like Taj Gary, I hope to God they're not putting Blackshear back there. A ton of times. I'll let Brian Harper on that later. Puts a new get there. We've seen Jalen on at the end of the year to me. I saw mismanagement on field last year when they were trying to put Rahim Blackshear to do that.

24:03 Tuff versus Jalen Holston, where Jalen Holston, by the end of the year, was the number two. And then the first time, they ran Marconi, the guy got like five yards, because he's 235, and he just plows into the line. He goes forward. So this group is high for me because Curtis to do something. Karen is talk, talk him off. Talking her, this this team, this team up until last year, hadn't had a running game, consistently since 2011, and the guy that was a catalyst for that leaves your putting Rocket 88 today. Well I'm going through a Time grading them based on where I feel. This is my highest confidence room because there's depth there.

24:43 There's guys we've seen Flash I'm not worried if Jalen gets banged, I feel Keshawn could come in. If you know, Marco somebody is still going to be able to come and run, but beyond the softness because of the offenses plays in the schematics, it has potential for success and that's why I'm going there. Not that. There's like this guy's going to go 1,800 yards and averaged six and a half a carry. That's not the reason. There's just so many bodies there compared to some of the other rooms. Here's the thing, too. About the running back room to your point. Chris the fact that under Justin Fuente, this Cam finds ways to run the football regardless of whether or not they have a Bell cow back, right? I think that's clear and it's it's not always going to be a really successful running game.

25:34 I think we know that at this point, but they're going to do enough to keep the defense off-balance and they're not going to have Another Khalil Herbert for a long time and that's that's not a slight at anybody, they bring in or it's just what he did last year was historic in terms of the running back position at Virginia Tech. People need to understand, I think a lot of people do, but a lot of people, I think just kind of gloss it over because the team didn't play, as well as a lot of people had hoped like, that was a really historic season Aegis, add terms of yards Carrie in terms of yards per game, all-purpose yards. He was one of the top backs in the country Virginia Tech has it had that, you know, forget forget about 2011, with David Wilson.

26:24 They haven't had that really in a long time, even going back to, like, Darren Evans Ryan Williams. I mean, they've had some strong running games Lee Suggs, but, Khalil Herbert is right up there with any of them. Oh, yeah. And he was outstanding last year and that's really hard to replace. But again, you know, they got a lot of guys in this room, whether it be the Sounds like Jalen Holston or Rahim Blackshear, you know, kind of coming into his own as an upperclassman. Again, I'm with you Curtis, like I would prefer to have her here. Blackshear play more in the slot, play more outside of receiver, play a little bit at running back. I want him kind of all over the field. I don't want him lining up, carrying the ball 15 times the game.

27:04 I don't think that's his strength. I don't think that's that. That's what the coaching staff envisions him doing and you guys will remember, I mean, they were hyping up Raheem Blackshear more than pull her. Last year. And then, you know, Blackshear got a little banged up, had a hamstring injury. Never really came into form. Like, the coaching staff was hoping, but he's got an opportunity to be really Dynamic. I like the Freshman Jordan Brunson a lot. I don't know if he'll get any carries but I like him. I like his potential. A lot 6-foot 215 pounds. I mean, he's got good size, he's got decent speed, he's got very good athleticism. I like his tape from high school a lot and I don't think he's being talked about. About nearly enough right now.

27:46 But again there are so many different guys that I think, you know, could potentially play a role. I mean, I'd love to see Marco, we play some but he's going to be that Niche. Like short yardage guy feel like and in this offense we're always a shotgun out, know how much he's really going to actually have that role and have that opportunity. We all love Keshawn King to but the whole Kenny put on weight, you know, can you hold his weight at the division? One level? That's, that's the question as well. Also, there are so there's so many questions in this room to and like uncertainty with a lot of these guys that it's hard for me to have a lot of confidence. I put it like three or four.

28:27 Okay I mean I I just don't I don't know enough about a lot of these guys that we may have to rely on. I mean that's just the bottom line. I'm close to you there. I so I see this unit is kind of like a Hi Flor, low ceiling unit. I feel like they're not going to be bad just because they have a lot of guys and a lot of guys that at this point I've seen some action but we as you said we don't have a Bell cow. We don't have a Khalil Herbert, I don't think Holston can step into that type of role. I feel like he's more of a want to say plotting back, but he's gonna get you solid carries but he's not going to be the guy like Herbert that breaks that one tackle and now he's out in the secondary and he's president of extra yards. Yeah he's not going to get those at least not at the same level that Herbert did.

29:24 I mean a lot of times on that outside Zone he would you know, shoulder shrug one tackle and next thing you know, he's at the next level and up the sideline I feel like King has a lot of potential with. As you said, can he keep on on the weight? I think it sounds like he's making some progress with with To get on. The question is, can he keep it on? Keep it on in season when it matters to stay, you know, keep his body healthy enough to take the the bangs in the hips that come at playing running back. And, you know, Marco Li big guy definitely more of a niche player though, as you said short, yardage goal-line scenarios don't see him getting much in the middle of the field unless you know it's one of those third and shorts and we don't call quarterback power in those situations. We we Give the ball to a big back and let him get the first down there.

30:16 But as you said though, I would say, you know, Brunson and Hampton or probably in played. I don't know if they're going to get a whole lot of snaps. But I really like brunson's tape and I look yeah, coming out. So you know, he has the potential if he puts the pieces together to pop and maybe compete for some snaps. But I really want to see Blackshear more in the next group are going to talk about than this group. I think he's more of a like, Percy, Harvin type player like, yep. He'll he needs to take some carries out of the bag, feel he needs to run some routes out of the backfield and things of that nature. But he doesn't need to be your spell back or any sort of every down tight player from the running back position. He's gonna have to take some damn snaps at quarterback at some point.

31:00 Probably, well, there is, you know, there's one person out there that's potentially being recruited that I feel That if it happens, you could have a Khalil Herbert situation again because of his talent. I'm not mentioning his name. I think anyone that is in the know, if Virginia Tech football know who I am talking about, but the events that happened yesterday with someone in his family, not looking great. So we'll see. Brian. You already mentioned it. I'll set up the softball to you big guy, wide, receiver tight in. Where's your confidence level on this one, run? A 3, I'm at a 3 on wide receiver.

31:44 And it really has all to do with You know, it's a whole lot of question marks. Once you get past the name's Trey Turner and TV on Robinson. And we're going to go ahead and throw tight ends in here in this group and James Mitchell would be the other name that you would mention there. I think we have a lot of really good receivers that can play in the slot, whether it be freshman or a Raheem Blackshear, but I'm not really sold on guys, that be on Trey Turner and tadion Robinson that can really step up at the at the outside there. Those are concerning whether we end up using James Mitchell in a similar fashion that we use Bucky Hodges, early, and twenties tenure that Used to be seen given the lack of depth, I think, at the position in terms of proven talent because you know, beyond the kind of first line guys, there's a, there's a bunch of names but not a, not a bunch of snaps behind those names, man. I just hire I hate.

32:54 I hate to just continue to say the same thing over and over again. But I feel just, I feel that this entire roster is so mediocre right now. Like it a lot of positions. Not not all positions will get to defense. I'm a lot more confident on that side of the ball. Pit on the offense. I have concerns man like At receiver specifically. Traitor norm and it's it's about time like we're getting it's getting to be about that time, buddy. Like we need we need some more production, right? Like it's getting a little late. Showed a lot of Promise as a freshman last couple years not so much, he's got a lot of potential. It continues to have a lot of potential and that's what's bothering me.

33:40 It's just kind of like he hasn't fully realized kind of the player that I think a lot of us thought he could be, you know, we first came to campus. I think we were all thinking. All right, I say afford type explosive plays right. Actually what I thought and then and then it just hasn't really panned out. He hasn't stayed healthy. It's been It's been a struggle. I get the quarterback position has been kind of revolving. Doors hard to get written with quarterbacks. I get it as a receiver. I understand James Mitchell is really good. It's awesome. They stuck around Nick, a low. I like him a lot. I just as a pure at the pure receiver position. I think changa Hodge could have really carved out a nice roll. It's unfortunate that he tore his ACL Jaden pay. You, I'm really excited to see him play. I'm also So a little bit nervous that he's not going to be as healthy as he would like and again it's anytime you have a foot injury when you got screws inserted and all that stuff, it's a total coin flip guys and I'd love for him to come back and be healthy and played his potential because I know the staffs very high on them and he's one of the few four stars on our roster at this point.

34:53 So I would like for him to produce at a skill position. Yep. And You know, Tavian Robinson. I like him a lot. I'm really excited in this room about the young guys, right? I mean, the one Lofton I think is going to play and play a decent amount, it seemed like he was getting a decent amount of snaps with the ones during the Spring. That's really encouraging Jalen Jones freshman out of Richmond, is another kid that I think has a lot of potential both inside and outside, he's a little bit bigger into one Lofton. So those are two guys who are Young, Who I think could play early. But I think my confidence level is still around like a for because Trey Turner can't really stay healthy and James Mitchell.

35:35 I feel like everything's going to key on them. So who's going to be the other guy? It steps up, you know, is going to be taping on Robinson, take on kind of a larger role now his third year and the offense is it going to be one of the young guys like Loughner Jones like, is it going to be Nick Gallo stepping up? Is he going to get more snaps too tight and too tight end sets, right? So you got to become more of a past catching threat. Now Like those are questions, I have and I just I think there's potential out of this group for sure. I just confidence is not all that high just because of injuries and health and depth and that sort of thing. I'm close with you guys on this one. I'm like it a full with this one too and it's not the guys are talented. You start looking at the gas trays, talented that first year, like you mentioned Mike. He exploded we expected more.

36:17 He's kind of only one up a little bit. Not really did this. Potential is there? Potentials there, Tavian same way, Tavian is growing his first year. The second year, you saw the growth and then pay you, if that guy comes back and has anything near the speed that he showed at, essentially the workout that got him. The offer and bumped him to a top hundred player, that's good. Blackshear Lofton, don't actually, have to do, much obliged, y'all love Dimension, here, I mentioned him in passing It's an idiot being, not being a running back, not being, just a slot games Mitchell and Gallo.

37:03 Even drink gave us. We know. He can be a solid tight end. What I'm more concerned with and why this group is a 4 and not necessarily like a five or a six is we've had talented groups before and we don't show how to put them in situations to excel. And what makes me angry, my. And I told Brian, that's a ton. If you've listened to us before. What do you mean serious is? I look at this offense and if you put these guys in the situations where they could Excel, you could have guys who are borderlining on 1,000 receiving yards. Not one multiple you have. Guys, who could be borderlining on Thousand rushing yards, not one multiple. But every time it's like, Okay, this is the year we're going to see more plays and it's like the same 15 plays. Yeah, instead would rather run the quarterback 30 times a game, you know, exactly.

37:55 So it's a gross mismanagement of talents and if you know to me and I'm probably sure to you guys. If Justin Fuente done win 10 games ago, the ACC title game, he's fired. It doesn't. I think that's I think that's it. See I I think, I think that's what should happen. But to be honest with you, in my opinion, when Whit Babcock and whoever else made the decision to keep want a around, They made their bed with that, and I think it's going to be more than a one-year experiment because I don't think you do the whole song and dance that this could be an entirely different podcast. I want to get us to off track but I don't think I don't think with Babcock says the whole song and dance of oh like this is really your one.

38:47 You know, we didn't have our facilities and didn't put enough funding in the football. Yeah. Like I think it would have to be real bad for Fuente to get fired. I honestly believe that. I think if honest to God, I think if you go Like eating for and only losses to like Notre Dame UNC couple, others West Virginia, maybe. And then like name, the random ACC game, we lose every year, like I think that that probably is going to be enough for him to stick around another year. I do believe that I don't, I got no I got no reason to believe that. This is going to work long-term. I mean, I'm I'm not optimistic guy, I didn't really understand why he was kept. I guess a big buyout all that.

39:33 I just feel like there was there were too many things said in that press conference by Witt Badcock to made me think man I feel like this is more than a one year thing. It would have to be real bad. It would have to like really really bottomed out because he's stuck around for this long. I don't know, but let me ask you before you jump. I want you to answer this too. Hayden for seven. And five does would get to walk up to him and say, you need to fucking fire somebody. Because this is, it should have already happened. Yes, right. I mean, it should have already happened. We, I mean, we're all on the same page on this.

40:13 We talked about this several times off the air, but this is like At that should already happens. I the fact. And I like, I like Justin Hamilton a lot and I like his potential and all that. But when your backs against the wall hiring a guy who's never been a defensive coordinator before is a hell of a decision. Yep. It's a hell of a decision. I don't know, I wouldn't have done it. I mean I all potential in the world has a chance to be really good. I like Hamilton. I think he could be a very good defensive coordinator. I get his potential but I feel like Fuente and the reason why he's in this mess is, he's hired too many guys based on potential. Okay.

40:53 And he's recruited too many guys based on potential and not like where they're actually at right now and I think that's why the programs kind of in the right there in. But anyway, that's a very, very good point. I like the way you said that a lot of potential but we haven't seen a whole lot of that potential come to fruition. Yeah, I think you know when you look at it just it just Hamilton lot of lot of. Lot of good things you're seeing, but I think there's definitely some Growing Pains that are going to come with hiring. A coach, that hasn't really seen a whole lot of action at the rapper five level at this point. And you know, we can address the elephant in the room that is Brad.

41:42 Carl Nelson. Yeah, probably put in a position where has potential but what we're seeing is that the deficiencies are in the offensive design or anything of that but it's in the the small situations in the game that matter whether it's Certain calls at certain times of the game or making adjustments when, you know, we do what we do isn't working, right? I've just I feel like this is, I mean, obviously this is a program on the brink. And obviously, there have been some tough years here recently and it's all about time, right? And I just don't know.

42:29 I'm confident listen, I'm confident that what Virginia Tech's doing as a nap. Light department to put more money into football and recruiting resources and all that I think that'll pay off. And I think Puente to his credit. I think he's made the right hires for recruiting and with some of his support staff to really attack something he's not very good at in recruiting. Yeah I just don't know if he's going to have enough time to reap the benefits of that and I'm not sure he's going to have enough time to reap. The benefits of Justin Hamilton has potential as a defensive coordinator and that's kind of, that's kind of just a trend With this program, I just we're short on time. I'm just not sure there's going to be that opportunity for you know, these guys to really kind of come into their own. Wonderful viewer, their hashtag fire corn, under that can be jump over to the defensive side of the ball as we are going to take a quick pause for a message from our regional partners. Alright, so now let's jump on the defensive side of the ball and I'm going to leave here.

43:40 We're going to start with the defensive line because the defensive line gets one of my highest grades. I'm giving it a 7 and it's not only potential as you guys have been talking about, but it's proven results, its depth. And it's a it's a line. We saw do, well, last year at times and not do so well at times, but there are also some key, correct, positional requirements. That we didn't have loved your all Hewitt. Garage Hewitt was not a defensive tackle in this particular scheme. He leaves in lo and behold a six foot four 317 pounds defensive lineman from the 757 transfers from Clemson. He is a prototypical defensive tackle in this type of scheme and not only is it one of these things where it's Virginia kid coming home, he get the feel-good story, you get a recruiting bump in my opinion because of the talk that he had about, like he created a great relationship with Justin Fuente while he was being recruited.

44:40 A lot of people didn't like to hear that but it does say that maybe all is not bad with our head coach recruits. But I sit here and I look at the names of maribor. No Pollard through the Kendricks guard but hopefully Belmar. I know he's going through some things, you know, where are you at? Mike with a defensive line group. Honestly, like a seven. It's one of my highest ratings as well. Just think about the guys that are kind of coming back into the fold right bar. No. Didn't even really have a full offseason to be a defensive end before last year and still produced, and now he has a regular offseason without covid. And all that stuff has an opportunity to really produce Taiwan gar butts back.

45:29 Emmanuel Belmar, has proven to be a very solid player for the Hokies. You got Robert Wooten and out, Brian on the outside on the interior, you obviously have Jordan Williams transferring in from Send Josh fuga has an opportunity now to be you know really good and kind of grasp and more of a role on the interior defensive line you got norell Pollard as well. I would would have just absolutely Just love to see this unit with like a full off season last year, like a real opportunity to kind of gel because bar no-shows, so much promise. And he's so freaking athletic and the fact that he was able to play as well as he did. Last year, without any real offseason practice at the position is.

46:16 So promising for this upcoming year, I'm really high on the defense guys. I think defensive line has a chance to be really good. And I'm interested to see, you know what, JC price kind of coming into the fold. You know how that Dynamic works out without Darryl Tapp because built secure link has proven to be really good and the opportunity now for j.c. Price, not only on the recruiting Trail, but to come in and kind of add a new voice to the room, on the defense side of the football. I'm really excited to see that. Plus the fact that these players get an entire offseason to kind of move forward. One other quick note to Sean Crawford would have loved to see M, stick around. I understand why you transferred out of the program. I get it.

47:00 It's it's a numbers thing. Just a lot of town. Two guys on the interior defensive line for Virginia Tech but I really liked him a lot. He was always fun to interview like he was great in press conferences and stuff like that. So personal affinity for the guy, but he was also a pretty solid player and it's kind of a bummer that he's gone. I think you would have been great but this is a really, really good unit here up front and I think has a lot of Promise. Yeah. I like I'm gay. This this group aa6. I like the Frontline guys, I like the second line, guys, I like the other hand full of guys that are going to work in. I know builds here, link likes to run at least two. Sometimes three line deep with his defensive line getting significant number of steps but just we talked about it a lot on this like the way bar no went from somewhat of a liability unless it was a third and long situation.

47:55 A week 12, where he finished the season was, was mind-blowing, like, dude came on and came on Fast and once he got it. I mean, he just took off, you know, having Belmar back Jaylyn Griff and see how Robert Wooten comes along like the defensive ends overall defensive tackle. I feel really good about. As you said, I would have liked to see if dashon Crawford would have stuck around how deep that unit would have been as well. But we still, Oh, got Pollard, we got Williams coming in still. Got Kendricks fuga. Got Max Philpott on scholarship now, I heard he had a pretty good spring, so, I mean, there's a lot of Promise in this unit, so I feel really good about them. And as far as the interior part of the line goes were actually for the first time.

48:44 I feel like maybe since mid 2000's, we were big inside. Yeah, not great weight. We you know, Jordan's over three. Food goes over three Pollard, your biggest undersized guy. But if he's deployed correctly in the right situations, Brian, you can attest to this. There's no probably there's only a handful of guards and centers that can deal with that quick. That Pollard has based on his size to strength. Like, you know, he's got a quick step, but he is strong. He's like 270 but he's built. Like he's strong enough to be 290. When you have that quick step and you have that strength, there's not going to be many interior lineman that going to be able to stop you. This is be honest.

49:29 This is probably the group that saved Justin Fuente job. Yeah. I mean for real, I agree. I agree. It shows that he could go out and land a big-time transfer and develop the group that's here because again Kendricks and Pollard and the guys have been here if shown it in far no for real and bar know I mentioned this to Braun a couple days ago Bardo. Got tap one-on-one last year. You mentioned, JC prices coming in JC, is a defensive tackle got more, he's coached the whole line, but he played defensive tackle, you feel like that's more his bread and butter. He's not going to get probably tearing it more. Or of the time. So it's almost like Darryl was able to shave the raw down and started. What we saw at the end of last year now you're going to get like the doctor to come in and say Here's what you need to do next.

50:18 Yep. I'll know it's promising. I mean I'm I like this group a lot and again I think this is one of the first times you know, since Bud Foster left that you're seeing You know, the bigger defensive lineman really come into the fold in a more prominent way. We've seen it bits and pieces, right? Even when Bud Foster was still defensive coordinator, we saw kind of bigger defensive lineman, start to get recruited a little bit and then you really saw it when Justin Hamilton took over and now you're going to see them in a more prominent role with a lot of the younger guys to like not just a Jordan Williams is of the world I'm talking about like yeah younger guys are going to have an opportunity to play here.

51:00 Yeah it's exciting and I think it needs to be done. Especially in like this new era of college football. I think you've got to have bigger defense, interior defensive lineman defense events. And you know the way that Bud Foster traditionally recruited defensive lineman, I think moving moving past that, honestly, for all the good things about possibly, I think kind of moving past that into this kind New Era up front on the defensive line I think, is for the best. Absolutely. All right, let's roll on. Let's take a look at the linebacker Corps Brown. Won't you jump on this woman? Because I feel like when we talked a couple days ago, we were feeling this kind of similar. And then I'll only hear what you got to say, mine. I will start off.

51:42 I'm going to go ahead and get my grade first. I'm giving this a for I feel okay about it. I don't really think the the recent news really changes how I feel about it. We've got Dax moving into Mike kishan artist and Dean Ferguson kind of behind him. I feel like that's a pretty solid three-man. Tandem for Mike where I'm a little iffy is is backer. Alan Tisdale is a talented player but he's been very inconsistent and he's been under sized to play the position. Looks like he's put on a little bit of weight.

52:23 You know, the word is that but becoming a father is kind of matured him a little bit. So I wonder if that's going to knock out some of the inconsistency in the game. So we'll see there. And then you got CJ, McRae coming in along, with Joaquin Rudolph at the backup position there. So we'll see how McRae kind of fits in and learns the system. And then, I know looking rudolph is on On a position change. So he's still kind of picking up the position as well. So behind Tisdale it's a lot of question marks as to how that's going to work out. So that's why my confidence is a little little hazy there. I feel pretty good about Mike but a little iffy about backer.

53:05 I'm at about a three and maybe that's low. Maybe that's a little bit more pessimistic. Maybe Papa Tisdale turns a corner, right? Like maybe maybe it comes into his own, a little bit again, you know, all the talent in the world and he's got a lot of potential, the inconsistency, kills me at backer. And that's why I'm a little bit low on the unit as a whole because when you go to Mike. Dax hollifield has been a little bit up and down. And that that concerns me to now. I think that moving over to Mike and traditional middle linebacker position, I think is for the best for Dax. He wasn't going to play that.

53:52 Obviously, a year ago, with Ashby still in the fold. I get that. And I think he has an opportunity to obviously, you know, come into his own a bit. But I'm a little bit more concerned about the wine backing core Pro depth standpoint to just because we don't A lot about the guys behind him like Dean Ferguson. For example, like I think he has an opportunity and a bigger role to play well, but it's something that obviously makes me nervous. If he has to take on a bigger role than anticipate because dax's and live up to the hype at middle linebacker. If that's doesn't, but too. To, to credit, this is Dax is natural position. He's been playing out of position for the last three years at backer, he was never a pathetic enough for on said, numerous times deck, me where he needed to be. There was just tons deck was one step. They're too late or, you know, didn't have the right angle because he didn't have the speed to get there. We're missed the tackle.

54:52 Sorry, I missed that, that's good. And I think Tuesday, Is your prototypical back his long as he's somewhere between 220 and 230, not 2005, and to 10. Because if he's small, it's an even bigger issue this year but I gave this with you Mike. I'm a three it's not because I don't trust his daelim Dax I trust them. I think those guys could be an excellent unit if they don't get hurt but it's a linebacker position. You're flying in there. You're using your body. You're trying to fill gaps at the mic position you feel okay between Dean and kashan. You're like look if this could work we can move, unfortunately Dax back. Backer. But if backer you know if it's just it's like as soon as one of those guys gets hurt you're like shit. Yeah yeah to say it's like in this wasn't a big room to begin with it's to me the last two or three years it's been significantly under recruited.

55:50 Yep. And I believe it's in CJ. McRae coming in and that's great. Maybe he's someone that You look at his you look at the size. You feel like he is a backer Joaquin. Was a backer, you know, what do they start a lot of loss in it. They start him it back or they move him to end immediately. Oh my God, you guys know I'm sorry, I'm sorry. You guys know how I feel about Lawson Awesome Blossom. Everybody loves welcome because we live in so many different ways because you see him and say good more he could beat remaining, right? He could be germane. If he puts 15 pounds on 20 pounds on, he could be germane. But then the Other Parliament, says shit. He could beat remaining 2.0 people.

56:32 We know I am and looked at the versatility that you guys were talking about, is that the big thing for me and you guys will remember factor in quarantine, we were all locked inside, and we're all on Twitter way more than we should be. I made the comparison that Lawson had a little bit of Isaiah Simmons in him, and I got dragged for me. All of a sudden Austin's got four stars. Now out looks so stupid right? Like this is the guy, it has that positional and all I meant was this is a guy who has positional versatility. Everybody was like always got a lip to Simmons, it's crazy, you put that on them, that's not what I meant. He's got versatility, he can play linebacker, he could, he could play, you know, out in the flat, right? I mean you can you can kind of line them up on slot guy. You can play mat defensive Bank, he's got the size and the length, the athleticism like he's really talented. Talented, and he's another bar, no type with a little bit more speed, right?

57:30 And Bardot was kind of in between positions, a little bit Wasson, I think in between positions a little bit and he can be like at remain. If you play him at linebacker, he can be a more experienced bar know if you line them up at defense event, like this is a guy that I think can really make a difference moving forward. Absolutely. So again it's on the coaching staff to put him in the right position day one, where he can become an immediate impact player. I love you, I lost and under this is we're going off a little bit. Maybe a conversation. We're going to be having two months from now, his athleticism. If that guy's not on every special teams unit every freaking game, your one, then you failed it, he's six foot four. He's probably going to come in about 215, 220 pounds, right? You can jump out of the room those training tapes. When he did some of those box jumps, like he was Box jumping where you seek to lead your kids boxed up. When either junior in high school So, like, getting in, on the punt block units on the field units, he clearly can help you again.

58:36 It's trusting the coaching staff to do it. All right, so we all feel terrible about the line measured. You guys are a little bit higher on tax and I am, I love Dax. I just He's been kind of bounced around a little bit hopefully he finds some stability at middle linebacker. I think that's where he's best suited anyway that's that's the hope I feel like you know I think we saw a little bit from him last year as the season went on start of the year, he was not playing well at all. I think his last like three or four games, he probably played his best football, the of the year. And I'm hoping that going to his more natural position is going to be the thing that he needs to kind of turn the corner.

59:21 With his with his overall career because I mean he's had a decent career but in terms of like where the expectations were year, one definitely has not lived up to that level of height. It's true, it's true. And I think being the out of position thing was the big thing and personally you said it earlier, I love but to death. I think Bud should have been Smart in 18 and realized I need to let decks it because God's not going to is not going to get his maximum time at the position. He is best for. Yep. And yeah, me, it's hurt Dax. It's hurt us.

1:00:02 It's heard the program in some way. Yeah. Let's roll on, if you're good, everybody good. Anything else on linebackers, by the way, we good, by the way, if he Ferguson does get in and he hit somebody, I think he is going to physically hurt somebody because Dean just like he looks mean, he looks old school like I'm gonna hit you and then probably stand over you, he's much more. He's he's much more like an ash be than then the dax's I will say that he's got a little bit of a little B, B to him. All right, let's roll. I want two safeties and whips. Braun. Leave this one for us, man. Where are you looking at safeties and whips with the big news this week.

1:00:45 Devin hundred back on the team. It's a little find some depth there. I tell you. I feel I feel pretty good. I'm giving this a seven between the nickel with position, which Amari in this year, people's boundaries safety, you got you know potentially Hunter back in there. You got Not take a daily that could work in there. Potentially Devon Taylor coming back. He's going to probably work with both the safeties and the in the corners there since we've got a little bit more depth this year than we had last year at that position. And you got Kanto Jenkins had saw some time last year played a little.

1:01:29 Well the start of the year they had all the covid stuff happen and then kind of didn't see as much of him as the year war on and then you got Jr. Walker that could work in there as well. So we got to I think a pretty solid group and a probably about three or four guys in the front line that I think could do. Do a pretty good job of holding down the safety position there between Connor Tay Devin and chianti. I like this group a lot, the Devin Hunter news changes, things dramatically. Obviously, now, Devon Hunter, you know, when he was recruited by Virginia Tech, I mean Remains the highest rated recruit in the Justin Fuente era. I think it's safe to say now.

1:02:13 We're three plus years in It hasn't exactly lived up to the hype yet. Now there's an opportunity now in front of Devon Hunter where he's got a position that he can walk down. He's been given a second chance, i-i'm really happy for him. I'm happy that the coaching staff gave him that second chance. I think, you know, not to go too far into that but he showed remorse. He You know did what he needed to do when he's handled it like an adult and I think that should be commended. Now on the football side, I think giving him an opportunity now to play safety and kind of emerge in that role. Like we have all wanted him to is something. We would really like to see and bring Aunt a daily is a transfer obviously played at Vanderbilt, a very bad football program, he was very good.

1:03:07 Yeah yeah, don't get it twisted. Very good football. Player that they brought in here. It's safety and just because he came from, Vanderbilt, doesn't mean you can't play. He can absolutely play and I think you'll make an impact. I liked what I saw out of Kiante Jenkins in a limited role early in the year last year. I think he had obviously has an opportunity to play well Jr. Walker is a guy. I thought would play a little bit more than he did last year. You know, he was in the fold little bit. I thought he play more but yeah I like the unit a lot safety and whip and Shamari. Sure I know is obviously going to going to play a lot and they'll move him all around the secondary. But yeah I like this here at a lot confidence. Level is about a 6 because even if they have to play young guys, I'm confident they can get the job done.

1:03:53 Because if Quixote Jenkins plays a little bit more than we expect, I'm okay with that. Like yeah, I think he can be a really good player down the line for Virginia Tech. Hopefully he stays with the program doesn't transfer. I hope that they kind of what his pallid enough. Right. And get him enough snaps because I think I think he has potential to be a really good safety here but yeah I really like this here at a lot. A lot of potential and the ceiling gets raised exponentially. When you add a guy like Devin Hunter back into the room with all the potential that he has. And the kind of recruit that he was, I mean he obviously has the athleticism and the ceiling to get the job done, but it will be really cool to see him. Potentially get that opportunity to kind of shine like we all expect him to Yeah, absolutely.

1:04:36 I'm with you essentially. All three of us where I'm at a 6 on this too because I think pay daily coming in. You lose, you know, Divine Diablo in the back end, but you have a guy like, Daddy, like you guys have said, he went to Vanderbilt, not good football. He was a big football player. Devon hunter in the thing is, let's flash back to August of last year in the comments that were being made Devon's ready, Devon's ready? It was just like I think everybody you know connection like oh my God he is going to take over the Rover, boundary safety position and he is going to excel. Then everything happens, he does all the right things. He gets back in with the football program. So it not only bolsters that positions where you can say that was the weaker of the two positions, because Kiante played free safety last year.

1:05:23 And with this, you've got The fun coming in and obviously he's probably immediately going into August, like y'all better be ready because he's going to take that position from whoever's in it right now. Y'all thought he was motivated before watch now exactly and his talented and athletic as he was that rooms ready. The death behind him between Jr. Walk account, the genomes and one person that y'all haven't mentioned Galen strowman is going to see sometime this year. He's going to see a ton of special teams. He's going to see some on the field with the regular unit. He's one of those guys I kidnap, we went through guys.

1:06:04 You mentioned collapsing at the 4 star month, if Jalen's permanent had a real season last year. JLo started would have been a four star Without a doubt. And You've already might you we listened to some of the interviews and we've spread some of the stuff they're high on Jalen right now. They are they really are and I think you could play some too. I agree. They're going to find ways to get him on the field for sure and I don't know if I'm sure they'll tow the line with the four-game Redshirt rule. Especially if there are no injuries they're going to tow the line there they're going to mix them in if there's an injury I think I'll play a lot more.

1:06:44 But listen, guys, as far as the recruiting goes and as far as you know, some of these guys are concerned with like Lawson and strowman in particular, there are guys who really did not benefit from not having to season great. Not having to see it at least when they were really getting recruited. And, and look, yeah, well, yeah, and there's some really talented players in. Not only protects recruiting class but recruiting classes across the country, there are being overlooked because there weren't Because they're, you know, weren't football seasons at least in the fall when they were really getting recruited. And I think in strowman and Lawson's case in particular, they have an opportunity to make a huge impact even though they're rating might not necessarily reflect it.

1:07:30 Big Time. Absolutely. Yeah. We were talking about that, like not having the Camp's not having a fall season and it's probably going to impact you know, the the 22 class just as much as it has impacted 21, the great, you know, we're going to we're going to see some of that trickle-down. We're already seeing that, you know, so many this cycle have kind of waited to commit before, you know, this Dead period. Kind of lifted, they can get into these camps and they can get on campus and things like Like that. Yeah and I'll give the staff about look at the staff credit. I think there's some ball players and their recruiting class. I just got and I know the rating wasn't there. It was an improvement from from the, you know, class, two cycles ago.

1:08:13 I for sure, but there are some ballplayers there and I know it wasn't the highest rated class in the ACC. I know wasn't as high as a lot of fans would have liked but there's some ballplayers there and there's some guys have a lot of potential. Yeah, it's one of those classes that potentially They're just a winter as the head coach in through 24 years or not. The people are going to look back and there's gonna be some guys there that are playing huge roles whether he's the coach or whether we have a brand new coach Mike. I see you're a very happy man right now. Your Bruins closed it out and ot2 one. So oh yeah. Good for Hamilton in. I help it. If we don't hear you like stopping like shut up.

1:08:56 We just scored. I'm celebrating the drink. You guys are Jeremy. You guys. Had Jeremy on here. Like there is a weird 90 minutes of Jameson. Right. It's a lot to live up to you. That's right, there's times where we're sitting here and just Chad, the next thing, you know, like he's like staring at a game like Bron that son of a bitch. Just did. So and so Brian. By the way. Braun. We are a few minutes away from your Lakers tipping off. Yeah, yeah. Zero confidence in that. Just like I do in the quarterback room. There is no play though. He'll be okay. We'll see it again. All right, let's go to the last group guys and wrap this up tonight quarterback. And I'm going to, I'm going to jump on this one. I'm putting quarterback at a seven between Dorian strong. Great freshman All-American campaign, hopefully, and I'm put it at a seven out of six.

1:09:54 Hopefully, an optimistic that your main water gets back to his 2019 ways along. Along with guys like Brian Murray Armani Chapman, who got a ton of playing time last year, the new man on campus today. Do you harvest them out in California? I just feel like the depth of this room, they're good. Could I want to see your main water and get back to that 2019 form? Because it's germane, Walter gets back to that 2019 form. My opinion is in the first two days of the NFL draft remain Waller will be gone off the board. That's my opinion. Yeah, I think last year him being banged, probably gave me that seven because so many younger guys got the opportunity to get on the field and to get that knowledge that you can have a thousand spring practices actually being in the game against the component, against your competition. That's how you grow the most I'm at Nate with this group. Yeah, I'm high on this great guys. And I look and, and part of the reason why I'm so high on the corners in particular, is because you also have guys that safety who can kind of slide around, if their depth issues and injuries one guy that I didn't mention. And I don't think you guys mentioned either, Devon Taylor. Like I mentioned him in the safety group, I was saying he could play call our safety here now down and out. Listen, now if he plays some corner where like he had to slide and safety last year on

1:11:24 the Sesame, if you play some corner, I mean, we're cooking with gas and then you got DJ Harvey as a freshman. You got your main Waller. This is a really talented group, guys. Free on Marie. I think Briana Marie's, fantastic. Dorian. Strong obviously freshman All-American, really good player. Free on Marie if he doesn't get covid. I mean, he's an all ACC player last year without Waller in the fold and he got kovin, kind of things went sideways, he missed a bunch of time but brie en mer, he's a really good player. There's depth all over the field and the secondary. And, you know, I mentioned, I think I put safeties at a 6, I put Corners at an eight. I think you obviously, if you average the group The Seven, I mean this is the street, this rank the teams. Secondary the defensive backs, the versatility, the way you can mix and match their going to be a lot of talented guys here. This year, the don't play a lot of snaps, just because there are too many guys for to few spots.

1:12:28 I wish we end again, roster management, right? You have a lot of really good players here in the secondary. Like I wish we had that problem all over the field then we're like Clemson. We got what logic players like Jordan Williams who would choose transfers in who didn't play a lot of Clemson obviously really capable and talented player. We got to have that problem everywhere. Then we're cooking with gas. Yeah, I'm right with you there. Mike, I've got a as well Jermaine. Well, we're coming back. Hopefully fully healthy. Ready to roll. You got Dorian, strong had a great freshman campaign, Breann Marie that you mentioned, it was playing really well before he was injured Armani Chapman is really talented even though he's been somewhat inconsistent.

1:13:12 And then, you've got Devon Taylor. That's With the depth that we now have at safety, you know, can slot in there at the quarterback position where he's more of a natural fit. Then you got the young guys coming in between DJ Harvey and a couple of the other younger quarterbacks that we had in this class. I just, I feel really good about this group. You know, you really got 55 players that have seen significant snaps at the quarterback position at the power 5 level, two of them that have done it very damn. Well, and a couple others that that working, you know, played well in spots, even if they were consistent in their total campaign for 2020. What's also be realistic guys, Justin Hamilton actually had a spring to install.

1:13:58 What the hell he wants to do? Yeah, last year it was on the flight. Now what do you disagree or agree with what he tried to do to install it? A lot of people will tell you dude you should have you new blood system like the back of your hand. You should have stuck with it. Maybe they win 8 games last year. Maybe they wouldn't sell, maybe they have a better season and we're not where we are from a Viewpoint of the coaching staff, but he didn't. But I think that also helps this year because I actually can give you game footage against North Carolina Clemson. Do you, where you messed this up? This is in game and now we have a spring to go practice it, make it, right? So, as we get into fall, we essentially put everything together as we March.

1:14:44 Towards Labor Day Friday. Yep. Yeah and I think just to him and talked a lot about like streamlining and keeping what's good and editing and things like that when he was talking some of the off Seasons videos we've seen so hopefully we'll see some of that obviously just having the time and the actual on field coaching that you can do with a spring with the full fall. That's going to pay a bunch of dividends and just having most of these guys that have already been in this. This system to a point for a season like Curtis mentioned, you know, I feel like they're going to be in a lot better place than they were especially at the start of the season last year but definitely, you know, for all I just think the quality across college football and I know we're talking about the Hokies but I think just the quality of football in September and October it's going to be so much greater this year and it was last year.

1:15:39 I mean A lot of a lot of teams season since start till mid to late September last year and then, you know, some teams in start to October and then you look at the Pac-12. Didn't start playing until November crazy. But like, when looking back on it, I think about the quality of football. We soften the beginning of the year last year, and I even just Virginia, Texas across college football, again, the last year to like the playoff. Once we got the college football, playoff, it was like, all right, like beasts. Teams are really good. Like we've never seen good football and it felt normal again. You know what I mean? Yeah, and I'm hoping that now with a real offseason and I think this will be the case, obviously, with a real offseason. You know, restrictions are being lifted. Everybody's being able to practice and bring recruits on campus, all that stuff.

1:16:27 Like I feel like Ryan get a better football season early in the year than we did last year. It was a weird year and I feel like we're just in Hamilton particular being able to install your scheme and have guy. Is be able to be comfortable with kind of what they kind of learn on the Fly last year. I think there's an opportunity for a lot of young guys to play early and play well and a lot of the veterans play a lot better than we saw a year ago. Yeah. I'll say one thing I know Curtis you mentioned like you're choosing not to go kind of more back to Budds elements. Once once covid, hit that was going to be a hard sell because you were already, you know, mid-march you had already started your Installation. There was there's you no doubt have been full on, you know, changing direction, Midstream there. So that would have been a hard sell for your players. I feel like so you're damned if you do damned if you don't in a lot of ways, when it comes to that, that choice that Justin would have had to make it.

1:17:29 Is it and it was a tough choice to make at that point in time. I mean, what's happened essentially, the last 15 months is something potentially will probably never see again. In Our Lifetime like this. And you talk about college football. If you don't remember, Hokies essentially finish fall camp. They're expecting a one-week break, then we're going to play the first game. Who would break out happens? It's pushed back multiple weeks. We're not going to see that this year. We're not going to see that this year when Labor Day kicks off until Thanksgiving night. Is me.

1:18:10 And Brian will probably be sitting here at the computer me, staring at the television screen. Six drinks, deep screaming at some West 4th, Cavalry game, because we decided to get on MGM bets and decided to lay two hundred bucks on it, because we were going. Yeah. I mean, you know this is kind of going off topic. The full expectation is Lanes going to be full this year for Lane Stadium, to me is a plus 2. When Virginia Tech there were games last year that we're lost that a 10-lane stadium. Full capacity would have been wins. That's my opinion.

1:18:54 Yeah. Are you talking about Liberty? Yeah, I was just yes, I'm talking about because that game. It's been mentioned in probably, everybody's heard there was no juice and egg. Now, the guys didn't feel it. And everybody bullshitted everybody set there and tried to say and we'll go on a tangent here. Well, we're to play delivered anyway with a fucking lost them, open and fucking weekend. No, they were, we probably would have beat them by 20 1. Don't give you this, but they're the same team. No Liberty played a bunch of cupcakes, leading up to Virginia Tech. They were able to completely install what they wanted to do.

1:19:36 Ooh, offensive ly Hugh freeze is a damn good coach. He is a damn good coach. He will not be at Liberty next year when they go down and three, I don't know where he'll be. I'm sitting here thinking, man, he will be somewhere at a power. Five job opening weekend. That doesn't happen, because he doesn't have time to fully install, and know how he's going to run against Virginia Tech. I agree? I mean, he's not art briles, right? I mean, he'll find a job, I'll be all right. Roughly. How many different servers? Yeah, it's not. I mean, that he's don't don't use the university.

1:20:16 Yeah. Phone like there's a phone. There were issuing you. Yeah, because all the escorts, that's what. Yeah, I mean he'll listen, he'll get a job. I mean people are going to take a chance on Hugh freeze. I mean, give me a break. Is he's going to Liberty, win nine, ten games a year. I mean it'll be they'll find a job Lane kiffin found a job. Like all these guys, you know, they find jobs, man, like it'll be, it'll be. Alright, I mean, art, briles different situation but I don't know. It's, it's interesting. I mean, I think this is a really important year for Virginia Tech obviously I think that having fans back in the stands will definitely help.

1:20:56 I don't think you lose a game like Liberty. If you got full capacity, I'll pee comes down to a final play. That was weird and everybody. I just want a bad coach. I mean, to be quite honest with you in the five years that Puente has been in Blacksburg his x's and o's in my opinion, have been okay. I disagree with some of the roster management stuff. Yeah but in game situational football by and large in five years, I've actually been okay with and that hasn't been the issue for me with him, it's been the recruiting. It's been the persistence to stick with your guys when you know that they're not Your guys being your staff by the way, when you know that they may not necessarily be the people for the job.

1:21:45 The hardheadedness has bothered me a lot. Okay. So first the in-game X's and O's, I've honestly been okay with for the most part. I think you spend a, he's been a fine coach from that standpoint. I think he knows football. I think we're not standpoint, he's a good football coach, there's other stuff. I worry about the people, man. Management. The Ross that you know the roster management as well when you extend it to actual players and then the recruiting has been a problem in college football. You're totally made by recruiting. I mean, there are a lot of a lot of good there. A lot of just okay. Coaches that make their hey on recruiting and they're just good recruiters and they stick around for a long time when he's not one of them. So he's got to find a way to kind of Remedy that I just don't know again, I don't know if he's going to have the time, you know?

1:22:34 It's true. And but the thing is, you talk about his recruiting. We've seen like when it leaked last years in a row Pollard video from the locker room internet. Yep. You sit here and say, dude, if you take that and let the public, see it, people are going to love you. You show fire, you show compassion. It's like he's one of these guys that has a probably behind closed doors has a personality that would turn on 95% of people. In someone's telling him or maybe behind the scenes in his mind. Well, I can't do this. I have to do things different where it should be. Just go be yourself because if you're making the players buy into you which again we see some of those videos. It looks like the locker room, a lot of times and bought into him.

1:23:24 You've got to get the fans to buying. You got to get the recruiting, you don't like it. That's fine. Essentially, a lot of head coaches, don't like it. But what they learned to master is they learn to master the final cell and they walk through that front door, the kids living room and they sell it to the parents and that's what he's got to learn. My bigger thing with him, the roster management is bad. The coaching staff Management's worse. Let us basket. But Alabama, the day Holloman Williams. Got that call from He should have looked at Brad. Poor Nelson and said you're getting a co-offensive coordinator holliman's going up. Yep, gonna pay Holloman. More housing was his best recruiter and clearly we have seen a steady decline in wide receiver flakes in Solomon left. With the exception of blocking his Jafar Williams, can teach some fucking blocking for his body, is wide receivers block their ass off.

1:24:17 They don't get a lot of catches block their ass, that's for damn sure. The other pieces, this is this goes back a long time ago, Mike probably when you were born or right before you were born with me with you and Donald pups. This is similar to 1993. And it's a place where Frank Beamer was against the wall, the Ada gave him the vote of confidence. Now, Frank that year made some significant changes to his coaching staff. Yeah. He essentially guys who had came with him, he fired. Yeah, but we didn't do it now. Maybe for one day, feels maybe some things change internally on how things are done, and maybe that's what he needs because one of these, this is the way I think.

1:25:03 Only us three is Hokie fans, too. We both called for his job last year, I called it after the Liberty game, Brian called it after the pit game, like, he's got to be fired, you wrote the damn article after the pit came you do it was annulled. It's over like I'm through we are three fans though who agree at a point in 2020, he should have been fired, but we are also three fans that sit here and say I hope we have a good season because it is harder to dig out from the bar. Bottom than it is to get your way back to the Top. If he has a good season, we're not down to bottom. We're actually on the way back up. We have a u9 season.

1:25:47 People can say yeah he's fired. Fuck him. Y'all know how tough it's going to be to overcome the look of being under four games. 500 over the last four. See ya you know how hard that is to overcome? Do you know, everybody says Nick Saban and Alabama, go look at the Alabama record leading up to a Nick, Saban got there and even huh. It wasn't that bad. It wasn't that bad but it still took saving once. Reason to get it figured out. Yeah, he was getting some studs in there. Yeah, we go to Rock Bottom. We are not the type of program that is going to have the one year bounce to be winning 10 and 11 games.

1:26:31 In some people don't realize. Yeah, some people don't study the history of Virginia Tech and don't understand until Bill Dooley. Got here. Jerry clay, when was the other guy that had significant 10 years? That was a really significant and successful head coach until do. The games may not be took me till 86 to give you the Peach Bowl. And then, well, obviously everything came out that he was doing a lot of shit under table and fucked Frank's First Years up. So Don't always wish for someone to get fired because if it happens, it means it's going to be a bad season and it's going to take a lot of digging to get back to where we were in really, where we were just four short years ago.

1:27:14 Yeah, to two quick things. The point you made about, you know, wanting success. I battle with people and social media because I mean you guys know this battle people at Battle people on social media because Like, oh, you should want want a to be fired because we should expect more? Yeah, we should absolutely expect more. We should be, you know, how are you absolutely sure. The next guy is going to be more successful in the guy we have now, right? And that doesn't that doesn't mean that you don't fire. The guy you have now. That's not what I'm saying. You can fire him but there's no guarantee you're going to bat a thousand when you hire the next guy. Yeah.

1:27:57 You should want the current guy to have success and it's really hard to dig out from the bottom. Curtis, that's a great point. It's really hard to dig out when you hit rock bottom because it takes years to rebuild that culture to rebuild that that trust in recruiting that you're doing the right thing. You're making the right strides, you got to want to have the coach that is in place right now to have success. You know, there are people who are negative all the time on social media you know, talking about recruiting be A door team being bad. Like, we can all see that, but you talked about constantly doesn't make it any better, right? Like, you got to want to have success with the guys that are there.

1:28:42 Now, you got support the staff, that's there. Now, as a fan, even if you don't believe they're the right, people, leave the lead the program, that's a huge point. And then the one other thing you mentioned Curtis about, you know, Beamer and you know, the early 90s and he made the decision to Kind of fire the guys on staff. That's kind of the problem I have with want a, yes, we're circling back. This kind of total 180 from what I just said, circling back to 220 himself. The difference between Beamer and Fontes, Beamer pulled the trigger on guys. He was friends with. So you did want a hasn't done that, right? Yeah. Obvious guys, core Nelson and get use engineered some of the highest rated offenses and text history, but it's the got it. It's the place in the middle of the game, right? It's the roster management with some of the guys were like, you know what, they should get the ball more, or you just start this guy quarterback, your quarterbacks coach, right? You start at quarterback, right?

1:29:43 It's that kind of stuff that bothers us with cornelissen. It's not the play design you know play designs. Good. That's real problem. That's not the problem. And you know people say is play designs trash. I just you know you discard that discard that That that's, that's not correct, right? He's already brought. I'll let the man. I'll let the big guy talk about. Yeah, we talked about his all the time. Play design is not the problem when he's on, its how those plays are called, the sequencing, the situational calling situation, those things, and how to, as you said, how to deploy the talent you have on the offensive, your offensive weapons, how you deploy that you get them the ball. Exactly.

1:30:24 I played for a coach and hampden-sydney that like he had a very basketball buying said he wanted to Get the ball into the hands of his Playmakers as much as possible and I feel like we don't we don't do that for that. I while we do that. Yeah, well we do that. And then the one, the one more quick thing is and I kind of got off-track there. But the one thing I wanted to finish with here is that went a didn't make the decision to fire his friends. Yep. And you look at Brian Kelly at Notre Dame in 2016. They go for an eight. You fired his friends. All right everybody. And I'll give you fire is Friends. You've hired the guys that weren't his friends, right? I've never cleaned house and they've been averaging ten or eleven wins ever since. And they've been either in the college football, playoff or Fringe college football.

1:31:11 Playoff teams have been a top 10 team in the country ever since and Puentes insistence on staying with the guys, he's friends with could lead to his demise in my opinion. I agree. I agree. Well my, before we wrap up, we wanted to give you a little opportunity here to kind of promote anything. You're working on, anything you want to talk about will just kind of give you the floor here for a little bit. Yeah, sons of Saturday.com. Go check it out there. I write a lot more during football season and basketballs, isn't that you right now in the offseason but will be getting a bit more into that now as the off season progresses a little bit basketball conference, Like ACC football that's one of the podcast. I do just covers the entire ACC so go check that out and then for hokey coverage I do have my own Virginia Tech football, podcast, hokey hangover, go check that out as well. We recorded something actually this afternoon on you 2D situation and 700 returning.

1:32:15 So definitely go check that out. We try to record about once a week, but the offseason is a little bit less frequent. Yep, we know all too well about no, that's terrible. My we really appreciate you joining us tonight and that is going to wrap up this episode of The Boundary Corner podcast on with Mike. McDaniels, I'm Curtis Wilson. I'm Brian sigla, visit our website down Derry corner. Be t.com to listen to all of our episodes while you're there. Don't forget to follow us on Twitter, Facebook, subscribe to our YouTube account where you can catch these streaming live when we do them and your favorite podcasts horse inserting Spotify. The Amazon and apple podcasts, if you're looking to join, the Hokie Club.

1:32:59 Help retrieve the Reach For Excellence, campaign goal. Please visit boundary corner be t.com forward slash giving to get started as always we let our buddy from the NRV close this out. Jason long, catch him on Spotify and apple music is always we thank you guys for listening to look for your feedback. Please give us some reviews out there and as always, On Mike. Let's go. Okay.

Mike McDaniel

Sports Writer and Podcaster

Mike McDaniel graduated from the Pamplin College of Business at Virginia Tech in 2015. He has previously written for Gobbler Country on the SB Nation network, Fighting Gobbler for Fansided, InsideTheACC.com, The Tech Lunch Pail, and most recently for Sports Illustrated. In addition to writing, Mike is also the host of the Sons of Saturday Hoops podcast, co-host of Basketball Conference: The ACC Football Podcast and the Hokie Hangover Podcast covering Virginia Tech athletics.

Gauging Depth with Mike McDaniel